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They have suppressed all knowledge of the stores purchased in the Red Sea, and of those supplied at Madras, as well as of her repair and refit when she was docked at Bombay, in the months of October and

fore be guided by the opinion of the house, | tween December 1801, and June 1803! whether he was bound to abide by his former notice in bringing forward his question to-morrow, if the letters moved for by the hon. member should turn out to be of such a nature as to place his intentions in a view in which they ought not to stand, or in-November, 1802; notwithstanding they volve any new matter that required farther have, in that very paper, given credit for deliberation, or rendered necessary the pro- eight months stores which were brought duction of other documents, in order to the home in her, and must of necessity have fullest and most mature discussion of a been received at one of these places; and subject so highly important. To vindicate that it appears (page 114), "a frigate could his own conduct, as well in first proposing not have come out of dock at Chatham, to bring forward the enquiry, as in perse-by two tides, had it not been for the Romvering to that end, he begged leave to read ney's sea store of copper!" They cannot the following passage from the letter of Mr. plead ignorance of these transactions; the Tucker to the board of admiralty, so strong purchases in the Red Sea have been reand so clear upon the subject, that he was ported on by the navy board to their lordat some loss to conjecture how the navy ships (page 378), and the repairs at Bomboard, by any letter of theirs, could refute bay have proved on oath (page 99), by the statements evidently made upon the ground carpenter of the ship at Chatham, before of their own reports and accounts: "ha-the junior surveyor of the navy! These ving, I trust, fully vindicated every part of facts, sir, speak too plain to require any my conduct through the whole of this in- comment from me, or to be susceptible of vestigation, I think it my duty to their satisfactory explanation any where, but at lordships, to the country, and to the house their lordships' table, or at the bar of the of commons in particular, to call their at-house of commons.-Having shortly adtention to one of the papers which has been verted to this passage of Mr. Tucker's laid by the navy board before the house of letter, he begged leave to ask the hon. commons, dated the 19th February, 1805, member, whether the vindication he pro(page 301,)' purporting to be " an account posed to bring forward, applied merely to "of the expences of the Romney, from the this part of the letter of Mr. Tucker, or "25th Nov. 1800, to the 2d June, 1803, to the whole; and to this question he reas nearly as can be ascertained at the navyquested to call the attention of the house, "office," in order that their lordships may for it was of much importance to know, whejudge,whether that paper could have pos-ther the vindicatory letters were intended sibly been drawn up with any other view to cancel the errors stated in this parathan to deceive and inislead the judgement graph, or whether they took a wider scope? of parliament. That account is declared to If to this only, he should bring forward his be framed, so as to bring under one point motion to-morrow. But if to the whole of view." how much she exceeded the pro- subject of enquiry, he should think it inportion of the vote of parliament allowed decent to press his motion, until the house for wear and tear, or came within that had full time to consider the subject of sum." Sir, in that statement there are those letters, and be prepared for any subomissions of the most extraordinary nature ject of discussion they were calculated to and magnitude ; and I must take the liberty introduce. to add, in the language of the navy board, Sir A. S. Hamond answered, that althat I scarcely think there ever were such though the letters in question were certainextraordinary means resorted to, to pro-ly directed to the leading subject of the duce a particular effect! Will the navy board lion. gent.'s motion, yet surely there were pretend that they have not examined other topics to which it was equally neces◄ that account before they signed it, and that sary to direct refutation. He could assure their confidence has been a second time him, however, the letters were so short as misplaced, and upon whom will they charge to require no delay for consideration, and it? Or, sir, will they continue to vouch for might, he hoped, be printed in time, or the fairness and truth of that paper? might lie on the table for the perusal of Sir, in that paper they have omitted, by members; and as to the delay of the navy what accident they best know, all her re-board in writing to the admiralty to refute pairs, and the stores supplied to her, be- the assertions of Mr. Tucker, no avoidable VOL. IV. 2 S

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delay had occurred; for when the hon. mem- now seemed to be in the contemplation of ber was informed that the navy board were gentlemen, namely, an open discussion by unremittingly employed in their avocations the whole house; but that it would be much from ten in the morning till six in the evening every day, he would perceive they had little leisure to answer the long letter of a gentleman who had nothing to do. He begged to observe, that the navy board were brought into this question in a very extraordinary way. The hou, officer, who was the object of the enquiry, had stated himself to be extremely anxious that it should come forward, but on reading the original report, he stated that there were considerable inaccuracies in it, and referred for revision to the navy board; upon which revision it appeared that there were such inaccuracies. It was then upon this report that the imputations of Mr. Tucker were founded; but he trusted the navy board would not be refused the right of producing correct statements for their own vindication, which he pledged himself would prove those imputations to be unfounded.

more proper to refer the question, with all the documents thereon, to the investigation of a committee, who should be instructed to report the evidence, with their opinions thereon, to the house, and such he undersood to have been the original intention of the hon. member who proposed the question. But if it was to be an open discussion, he could see no inconvenience that would arise from the delay, if necessary, of a few days; but however that might be settled, he would take leave to say, it was quite impossible that any understanding on the subject should be arrived at to-day, as to any arrangement that might appear expedient on to-morrow. He hoped the house would not, however, proceed to any decision without a fair hearing, and affording a full opportunity to the gallant officer to bring forward every proof necessary for clearing his own character. It was not merely the character of the hon. officer, it was not merely the character of the navy board, that were at stake; there were other persons, in other quarters, whose characters depended on its result. It was

Mr. Kinnaird said he should persevere in bringing forward his motion; but he begged the hon. member to recollect, that the original report was made six weeks ago, and that no attempt had been made a matter that involved some of the dearest to correct its alleged inaccuracies until after the suggestions of the hou. officer (of whose vindication he should be as proud as any man) and on the very eve of bringing forward the question upon the original report.

rights of the constitution of this country, and materially concerned the exercise of prerogatives, which involved the safety of every man. A right hon. gent. seemed to think the subject one which could occupy no great length of discussion, but let it not be imagined, that the subject the question involved was to pass sub silentio, for it was one which demanded the fullest investigation.,

board stood in a situation of such high and important trust with the country, that it ought not to remain a single hour in a dubious light. He was therefore inclined to oppose any delay of the discussion not absolutely necessary; but as to the hon. officer, he could have no sort of objection to allow him every fair opportunity for his vindication.

Mr. Tierney thought it would be right maturely to consider upon which of the two reports the house was to found its deliberations. He thought to-morrow too soon, however, to bring the question for- Mr. Tierney was as anxious as the right ward, as the documents now proposed to hon. gent. to sift the subject to the very be brought forward might render it neces-bottom; feeling, as he did, that the navy sary to move for others. He could not see that the discussion, as it related to sir Home Popham, was likely to extend to any great length; for such was the nature of the several items for consideration, that it was impossible for any men but naval officers, professionally and technically acquainted with them, to be competent to the discussion. He hoped the hon. member would postpone his motion for a few Mr. Kinnaird said, he was far from abandays, more especially if the letters should doning the charge he had made, founded as turn out to be such as to require farther it was upon the reports of the navy board time for consideration. themselves; but it was impossible not to The Chancellor of the Exchequer was in-see that the navy board themselves were clined to think, the proper mode of pro-connected with the charge, for they as seeding in this case was not that which sumed to themselves that which only was

meant to refer to the conduct of an hon. officer.-The motion of sir A. Hamond was put and agreed to; and shortly afterwards the letters were laid on the table by Mr. Dickenson, and ordered to be printed.

comply with. He therefore hoped the hon. member would not be inclined to press such a series of motions, without giving some farther time for the house to consider the propriety or impropriety of agreeing to them.

vessels in commission, either home-built, or captured from the enemy; the like of vessels, manued and equipped for general service, and those for harbour service: these with a view of comparing the state [NAVAL ADMINISTRATION OF EARL ST. of our navy during the administration of VINCENT.] Mr. Jeffery (of Poole), earl St. Vincent; and those which precedagreeably to the notice of a former day, ed his lordship's appointment, and imme rose to bring forward his promised motion,diately followed his resignation. for the production of several papers, re- The Chancellor of the Exchequer said, lating to the naval department, during the that as to the first motion of those proadministration of earl St. Vincent; and posed by the hon. member, he had no though, he said, they were certainly volu- great objection; but he was by no means minous, there was not one amongst them prepared to judge of the propriety of agree. idle, frivolous, or unimportant; but suching, at the moment, to so long a string of as would not fail to make a strong impres- motions, involving such a variety of subsion upon the mind of the house, and fully jects, many of which, upon mature delito account for the depressed and degraded beration, it might be utterly improper to state to which the British navy was at this moment reduced; and which, had lord St. Vincent continued at the head of our naval affairs to this day, would have sunk to a state still lower, and less competent to meet the formidable enemy with whom we had to contend. He lamented that the Admiral Markham assured the house, task of bringing forward a motion of so that nothing could possibly give to the much importance should have fallen to the noble lord, whose conduct was the avowed lot of a person so humble and incompetent object of the motions just proposed, higher as himself; but seeing no other gentleman pleasure than the production of every doattempt to take it up, he felt it his duty to cument, and the fullest investigation of bring it forward. He was conscious there every circumstance that in any degree conwas no department in the country more cerned his character or conduct. That important than that of the navy, or that noble lord was conscious of nothing in his more urgently demanded strict vigilance conduct that he could have the slightest and minute investigation. He hoped his wish to conceal; and, therefore, on bezeal upon this point had not carried him half of the noble lord, and so far as he too far, or led him to endeavour to disclose was personally concerned, he had not the too much, for secrets there certainly were, slightest objection to the production of which ought not to be exposed to the pos- all the documents just specified, prosible knowledge of an enemy. Having,vided the friends of the noble lord were however, explained to the house the object to be at liberty to move afterwards for of the motion he meant to submit, it would be for their wisdom to decide how far it was right to grant his request; but if the documents he should require should be allowed him, he would himself undertake to prove, to the conviction of every man who heard him, the position he had laid down. The hon. member then proceeded to detail to the house a series of eighteen motions for returns of the state of the navy, from the year 1793, to the present time, under the several heads of ships of the line and frigates, built in the king's yards, or those of the merchants, distinguishing the periods when contracted for, and when finished, or likely to be finished; the like of such vessels, broke up, or sold, or lost by capture or accident; the like of such

the production of such other documents as they should think necessary on the other side of the question. But with respect to the motions, generally, he presumed the hon. gentleman was not aware of the extent and tendency they would go; not merely to the conduct of earl St. Vincent, but of the whole British navy, since 1793, to the present time. As to the distinction between ships built in the king's yards, or the merchants' yards, he had very strong objections, because it would disclose a history of the supplies of timber for our navy, and the sources whence furnished, foreign and domestic. And though the enquiry was certainly a most desirable one, there were very strong objections to a public disclosure of the result. The hon. admiral

had been so unhappy as to draw upon them the displeasure of the house by their conduct at the election for Middlesex, in 1802, at which they had presided as returning officers; for which offence they had been committed to Newgate on the 11th of March, and praying leave to express their

nation might be expected to throw fuller light upon the question; but in acceding to the proposition of the noble lord, who had an essential amendment to propose, he trasted that no further impediment would be thrown in the way of the subsequent progress of the bill. The result was, that the report of the bill was ordered to be re-sincere sorrow for their said offence; and ceived to-morrow, and an apparent under. standing, that on Monday, the bill should be read a third time.

as longer confinement would be prejudicial to their health, and their private concerns, to intreat the indulgent consideration of The Lord Chancellor presented a bill, the the house. The petition having been read principal effect of which was, to encourage by the clerk, was ordered to lie on the tathe cultivation, planting, &c.. of church, ble; and Mr. Fane gave notice that he should college, and hospital lands, and to provide to-morrow move that the sheriffs should regulations with respect to the growth, fel-be brought up the following day to the bar hing, &c. of timber on the same. All he in order to be discharged. -The Irish Post should propose at present would be, the Road bill was reported; to be read a third first reading, and printing of the bill, intend-time to-morrow. The Irish Bank Token, ing it should lie over for consideration; and Irish Promissory Note Bills, were read and, in the mean time, he should consult a third time and passed.—Mr. Huskisson the opinions of the reverend personages op- brought up a bill for rendering the last posite to him, and which he meant to take duties on wine permanent; another for previous to his proposing any thing farther repealing so much of the 34th of the king upon the bill. The bill was forthwith read as exempts slates under 20s, per ton from a first time, and ordered to be printed.-duty; and the Spanish Wine Importation Adjourned.

HOUSE OF COMMONS.

Wednesday, May 8.

bill; which were severally read a first time, and ordered to be read a second time to-morrow.-The Land-Tax Commissioners Name bill passed through a committee. Mr. Dent gave notice of a motion, [MINUTES.] An account was ordered of for an account of the officers who had the number of bushels of malt made from been promoted during the administration barley in Scotland from the 5th of July, of lord Spencer and lord St. Vincent, in 1803, to the 5th of July, 1804, with the duty the department of the admiralty.-The thereon; and from the 5th of July, 1804, to committee on the Thames Ballastage bill the 5th of April, 1805. Also, of the num-was discharged, and the bill referred to a ber of bushels of malt made in Scotland select committee.-A new writ was, on the from bere and bigg, with the duty thereon, notion of Mr. Grey, ordered for the counwithin the same periods.-A.person from ty of Galway, in the room of lord Dunlo, the office of the chief secretary in Ireland now earl of Clancarty, an Irish peer.-A presented at the bar an account of the ex- select committee was, on the motion of the pences incurred by state prosecutions in chancellor of the exchequer, appointed to Ireland for the years 1801,2, 3, and 4, re-consider of the state of the accounts be spectively. Ordered to lie on the table, and to be printed.-The Irish First Fruits bill passed through a committee.-Sir W. Dolben presented a petition from the chancellor, masters, and scholars of the university of Oxford, against the prayer of the Catholic petition on the table of the house. Ordered to lie on the table.-Mr. Lee brought up a bill for the more expeditious recovery of small debts in Ireland, which was read a first time.-Mr. F. Fane presented a petition from sir William Rawlins, knight, and Robert Albion Coxe, esq. late sheriffs of London and Middlesex, stating, "that, owing to unfortunate advice, they

tween the East India company and the public; and an order made that niue be a quorum.

[IRISH STAMP DUTIES.] Mr. Foster, on moving the order of the day for going into a committee of ways and means, acquainted the house, that pursuant to his declaration, when he had the honour to submit to the house the statement of the Irish finances, he now proposed to bring forward his arrangement for an augmentation of the stamp duties. The various heads on which he proposed an increase were as follows:-A considerable addition on the stamps on admission of attornies

that he might be able, in the mean time, to consider how far it might be proper to grant them; to which Mr. Jeffery agreed. Adjourned:

HOUSE OF LORDS.

Wednesday, May 8.

a measure with so thin an attendance of lay peers, and with such a body as presented itself on the reverend bench, he despaired of having his objections properly attended to. One or two of the reverend prelates having observed, that not many minutes ago there had been a remarkably full attendance of lay peers, the noble earl observed he was aware of that; their lordships were tired out by listening to a very long conversation: he intimated an intention to move to have the bill postponed.

[MINUTES.] The committee of privileges appointed to search for precedents relative to the message from the house of commons respecting lord Melville, sat from two o'clock till five, during which time no The Lord Chancellor observed, he should strangers were admitted.-Prayers were deem it incumbent on him to oppose such then read, after which the lord chancellor a motion: the noble earl should recollect, presented a petition from the university of that the bill, both in principle and detail, Oxford, praying that the restrictions on had been again and again discussed; with the Catholics might not be repealed, which respect to the objection of the thin attendwas ordered to lie on the table. The lordance of lay peers, a great number were in chancellor notified his intention of coming attendance not ten minutes before, who, forward on an early day next week, with a if they thought with the noble lord, with motion for having some record or entry respect to the operation of the bill on the made on the journals, of the principle upon which the proceedings that hitherto obtained in the case of Mr. Justice Fox proceeded; or, at least, as far as such principles were understood by some of their lordships. He was apparently about to move for a summons in reference to his contingent intention for Monday, but was informed, that a summons already stood for that day.

lay patronage, would most probably have remained to express such apprehensions.Some few remarks, in the way of explanation, were afterwards interchanged between the earl of Suffolk and the noble and learned lord, in which the latter observed there might be some peers who preferred their dinner to their duty; and the former, seeming to think, as the proceeding then stood, it would be preferable not to trouble their lordships further at present, accord

[UNIVERSITIES ADVOWSON BILL.] On the order being read for the re-commit-ingly quitted the house. ment of this bill,

Lord Sidmouth expressed his- thanks to The Earl of Suffolk rose, and made se- their lordships for having so readily deveral observations expressive of his hosti- ferred the recommitment of the bill from lity to the bill; he particularly deprecated Monday until that day, in consequence of the discussion of a measure, which would his inability to attend; however, it was not so injuriously affect the lay patronage of his intention then to trouble the committee the country, in so thin an attendance of with the discussion of the clause he inlay peers. He thought, therefore, the con- tended to propose, as he believed many of sideration of the bill ought to be postpo- their lordships, who had so recently retired, ned, until a fuller attendance of the lay withdrew upon an understanding that what peers should be obtained. There was an- he meant to bring forward would not be other objection which struck him forcibly discussed that night. He therefore should with respect to the bill, namely, its in- not press it; not that he intended, after trenching so materially, in his opinion, what passed, to interrupt the progress of upon the statute of Mortmain. Though, the bill, but to take the opportunity of a he thought, in the present state of things future stage, to propose what he intended, and of religion in this country, great ac- possibly on the consideration of the report, quisitions to the church may not be ex- the third reading, or, if such may be deempected from such a consideration; yet, ed more convenient, as to a certain extent, from persons in a dying state, particularly it would be more regular to discuss his inwomen, something in that way may be re- tended propositions in a committee, and quired. Yet still, its operation with re-with that view to recommit the bill. spect to that statute was, he thought, a ma- The Bishop of Oxford was anxious to terial consideration. He again pressed the shew that he never opposed any procrastiidea of its being improper to discuss such nation of the bill, as far as such procrasti

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