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had been so unhappy as to draw upon them the displeasure of the house by their conduct at the election for Middlesex, in 1802, at which they had presided as returning officers; for which offence they had been committed to Newgate on the 11th of March, and praying leave to express their sincere sorrow for their said offence; and

nation might be expected to throw fuller light upon the question; but in acceding to the proposition of the noble lord, who had an essential amendment to propose, he trusted that no further impediment would be thrown in the way of the subsequent progress of the bill. The result was, that the report of the bill was ordered to be received to-morrow, and an apparent under-as longer confinement would be prejudicial standing, that on Monday, the bill should be read a third time.

to their health, and their private concerns, to intreat the indulgent consideration of The Lord Chancellor presented a bill, the the house. The petition having been read principal effect of which was, to encourage by the clerk, was ordered to lie on the ta the cultivation, planting, &c.. of church, ble; and Mr. Fane gave notice that he should college, and hospital lands, and to provide to-morrow move that the sheriffs should regulations with respect to the growth, fel-be brought up the following day to the bar ling, &c. of timber on the same. All he in order to be discharged.-The Irish Post should propose at present would be, the Road bill was reported; to be read a third first reading, and printing of the bill, intend-time to-morrow. The Irish Bank Token, ing it should lie over for consideration; and Irish Promissory Note Bills, were read and, in the mean time, he should consult a third time and passed.-Mr. Huskisson the opinions of the reverend personages op- brought up a bill for rendering the last posite to him, and which he meant to take duties on wine permanent; another for previous to his proposing any thing farther repealing so much of the 34th of the king upon the bill. The bill was forthwith read as exempts slates under 20s. per ton from a first time, and ordered to be printed.-duty; and the Spanish Wine Importation Adjourned.

HOUSE OF COMMONS.

Wednesday, May 8.

bill; which were severally read a first time, and ordered to be read a second time to-morrow.- -The Land-Tax Commissioners Name bill passed through a committee. Mr. Dent gave notice of a motion, [MINUTES.] An account was ordered of for an account of the officers who had the number of bushels of malt made from been promoted during the administration barley in Scotland from the 5th of July, of lord Spencer and lord St. Vincent, in 1803, to the 5th of July, 1804, with the duty the department of the admiralty.-The thereon; and from the 5th of July, 1804, to committee on the Thames Ballastage bill the 5th of April, 1805. Also, of the num-was discharged, and the bill referred to a ber of bushels of malt made in Scotland select committee.-A new writ was, on the from bere and bigg, with the duty thereon, notion of Mr. Grey, ordered for the counwithin the same periods.-A person from ty of Galway, in the room of lord Dunlo, the office of the chief secretary in Ireland now earl of Clancarty, an Irish peer.—A presented at the bar an account of the ex-select committee was, on the motion of the pences incurred by state prosecutions in Ireland for the years 1801, 2, 3, and 4, respectively. Ordered to lie on the table, and to be printed.-The Irish First Fruits bill passed through a committee.-Sir W. Dolben presented a petition from the chan- [IRISH STAMP DUTIES.] Mr. Foster, cellor, masters, and scholars of the univer-on moving the order of the day for going sity of Oxford, against the prayer of the into a committee of ways and means, acCatholic petition on the table of the house. Ordered to lie on the table.-Mr. Lee brought up a bill for the more expeditious recovery of small debts in Ireland, which was read a first time.-Mr. F. Fane presented a petition from sir William Rawlins, knight, and Robert Albion Coxe, esq. late sheriffs of London and Middlesex, stating, "that, owing to unfortunate advice, they

chancellor of the exchequer, appointed to consider of the state of the accounts be tween the East India company and the public; and an order made that niue be a quorum.

quainted the house, that pursuant to his declaration, when he had the honour to submit to the house the statement of the Irish finances, he now proposed to bring forward his arrangement for an augmentation of the stamp duties. The various heads on which he proposed an increase were as follows:-A considerable addition on the stamps on admission of attornies

and clerks; a rise on the indentures of ap- to oppose his motion for the appointment prentices, in proportion to the fees paid; of the committee, on the part of the gentlea rise on letters of attorney giving power men opposite. It would be unnecessary for to grant leases; on letters of attorney to him, therefore, to take up the time of the receive rents; on all leases for a reserved house by any prefatory observations, and rent above 201. or on a fine of 1001., pro- he should therefore content himself by reportioned to the amount of the fine or ferring to the many important documents. rent; on probates of wills, the stamps on contained in the volume before them for which would not be so high as in this coun- the ground of his motion. At present he try; on legacies; on almanacks, the stamp-should confine himself to moving, "That duty on which he proposed to raise from 6d. to 9d. each; and, lastly, on insurances of property against fire, which in some instances were higher, and in others lower than the duties payable; and, according to his arrangement, would be made exactly equal, in all instances, to the rate of duty in this country.-The house having resolved itself into the committee,

Sir John Newport said, he did not mean to make any objection to the resolutions, in this early stage; but he apprehended, that the stamp duty upon the indentures of attorneys' clerks might operate against the freedom of election, as these persons, after serving their clerkships, were at present possessed of the right of voting for representatives in parliament, upon which it was by no means desirable that there should be any additional restraint. He hoped, therefore, that the duty would be so modified, as not to be productive of the injurious effects he apprehended from it.

Mr. Foster replied, that he should be very ready to accede to any modifications the hon. bart. may think proper to propose for the purpose of obviating all his appre. hension. The resolutions were then agreed to, together with an additional one, that the foregoing duties be paid in English curreney. He further moved, that an allowance of 71. 10s. per cent. be made to all stationers in Ireland who sold stamps without any additional charge for the paper; which was agreed to.

[CONDUCT OF SIR HOME POPHAM.] Mr. Kinnaird, pursuant to his notice, rose to make his motion on the subject of the papers before the house relative to the conduct of sir Home Popham. He had come down to the house prepared to make such a statement as he trusted would induce the house to agree to the motion which he should have the honour to propose, for the appointment of a committee to examine the very large body of papers that had been laid before the house on this subject. Since he had been in the house, however, he had learned that there was no intention

the several papers presented to the house, relating to the repairs of the Romney and Sensible while under the command of sir Home Popham, be referred to a select.committee." On the motion being put,

Sir Home Popham rose, and declared that he would not make a single observation ou the present motion if he did not apprehend that a silent acquiescence might be construed into a tacit acknowledgement that the motion rested on an actual charge existing against him. If the hon. member had made his motion on that ground, or with a view to such an object, he should have felt himself bound to give it every opposition, because there was nothing of the nature of a charge against him in the papers which he could not completely and satisfactorily refute. There were, he would not dispute, several matters contained in these papers, which it was desirable to have referred to a committee, and consequently he was not disposed to object to the motion, provided that in so doing, he should not be considered as giving any acknowledgement of any well founded charge against himself. Many gentlemen, no doubt, had read the whole of the papers, and from being acquainted with their contents were competent to decide whether such a step was not expedient. His object in rising had been to state a general outline of his conduct, by adverting, if he should be permitted, to what had passed on a former night. The hon. member (Mr. Kinnaird) had on that occasion stated, that he had been treated conformably to the usual practice of the navy; that he had been treated in the same manner as three gallant and hon. officers whom he had mentioned by name, sir Richard King, sir Richard Bickerton, and sir Andrew Mitchell. He had been extremely surprised to hear this assertion, and though he knew that each of these officers had attended the different boards, he had been so nervous that he could not bring himself to contradict an assertion so confidently made. But he had yesterday received a letter from sir R. King,

confirming his own opinion, and stating chor, upon which so much stress had been that that gallant officer, on his return from laid, it now appeared that the whole matIndia, had had occasion to attend and ter was a mistake of the navy board. He correspond with the different boards on the owed it to the curiosity of a brother offsubject of his accounts. The navy board cer, who hearing so much about this cirwere justified, therefore, in the conclud- cumstance, had examined the original reing paragraph of their letter, wherein they cords at Chatham, and found that the ring had stated, that in his case there had been and shank of the anchor lost in the Indian a deviation from the ordinary practice of sea had been returned to that arsenal, that the board, and that he had been singled this mistake was corrected; his own letters out as the victim to such a course. He to the navy board on the subject having had felt it necessary to advert to this cir- been among the papers lost. When he had cumstance, because of the impression that sailed for India, he had a strong westerly might have been made on the house by the breeze, and he found the ship so crazy, so statement of the hon. member, and be- rotten, and so leaky, that he was obliged cause at the time of making it, the hon. to put into Portland Roads, and if it had gentleman had held in his hand, as a do-not been for the importance of the service cument, the scurrilous pamphlet that had on which he was proceeding, he should not been published reflecting on him. That have ventured in her. He then proceeded it was usual for officers to attend the dif- to the Cape, afterwards to the Red Sea and ferent boards on such occasions, he proved to Calcutta, where she was near sinking, as by reading an extract from a letter of the would appear from the papers. He trustnavy board to captain Sauce, contained in ed that the bad and leaky state in which the papers, in which that officer was called his vessel was there, would be a satisfacon to attend them on the Friday after the tory, reason to the house for the repairs date of their letter. In another letter, she had undergone. From the first mothey called on him to explain why he had ment of his hearing that an unfavourable provided the Sensible, at Calcutta, with a impression was entertained of his conduct greater quantity of stores than were al- by the admiralty, he had pressed earnestly lowed for ships of that class; and in a for a hearing. He had passed, under the letter it was stated that such increase had imputations that followed, the strongest arisen from an alteration of the establish- and severest ordeal that any officer ever 'ment of that vessel. The fact was, how-had. This would be evident from a referever, that he had never given orders for ence to the strange accounts that had such alteration, nor had it ever taken place been made up, as would appear from the in the establishment of the Sensible. His letter of the navy board by Mr. Tucker. letter to the navy board would prove that They had been told in that of criminal prothe Sensible had been nearly a wreck in the secutions, and if those should not answer, Red Sea; and he had given directions to of the matter being carried into the exchecontract for two sets of sails for her, pro-quer. But he contended that the law that vided, however, that if she foundered at ought to have been appealed to was marsea, or should not arrive, no expence should tial law; that law which had upheld the navy accrue to government: as to the establish- of England. He ought, if supposed guilty, ment of the vessel, he had given orders to have been brought to a court martial, that such a provision of stores should be rather than to have been made the subject made as would fit the vessel for any esta- of a paper war. He should have met the blishment which the lords of the admiralty court martial with the same fortitude that should think proper. General Baird, on his he had shewn in meeting the scurrilous arrival in the Red Sea, had proposed to pamphlet to which he had before alluded, him a plan, by the desire of the governor- which, from a letter in his possession, that general, for attacking, in the event of the he was almost ashamed to read, he had expulsion of the French from Egypt, and reason to think had proceeded from a the return of the Indian army, either the source which ought not to have stooped to Mauritius or Batavia. He was not pre- such unworthy expedients. The hon. mempared to say, that the force under his com- ber here read a letter signed John M'Namand at the time was adequate to such an mara, stating, in answer to a question put expedition, but he was anxious to have it by him to that gentleman, that he had in such a state of equipment as to be ready beard, from the publisher of the pamphlet, · for any service required. As to the an-that it had come from lord St. Vincent's

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He had in every instance retrenched expences, but on a scale deserving the attention of an officer. As to the canvass, which did not exceed in value 121, and the junk not 211. though the account occupied 3 pages in the report, neither could be supposed

board of admiralty. Before he should touch | the three branches of the legislature, and upon the other points, he begged leave to that they could not answer his question. advert to a letter written by the navy board, dated 11th of Feb. 1802, to capt. Mitchell, composed of exhortations and threats, and affording an extraordinary instance of an attempt to influence the evidence of an inferior officer. This letter called on capt. Mitchel seriously to exhort his boat-worthy of notice. He had deemed it neswain to state all he knew, and to inform him, that from the state of his accounts his evidence might have very serious consequences. This was a call upon him to rack his memory.

Mr. Kinnaird here called the hon. member to order. He had a right, no doubt, to read the passage from the letter, but he did not conceive it orderly to put. the meaning into another form of words; which appeared to him to be rather a comment than a quotation.

1

that no

cessary to advert to these topics, and
might have expressed himself with some
warmth, but he was sure that would be
overlooked, when it was considered how
long he had been exposed to the calumnies
so industriously propagated against him, and
how severely his own and his family's feel-
ings must have been affected. In the whole
of the expenditure he had been regulated
by a desire to have his ships as highly and
as well dressed as they could be.
He had
given orders in drawing for money
bills should be drawn at a higher exchange
than 2s. 6d. which was lower than the rate
of exchange on bills drawn by admiral Blan-
ket, who had also been in the Red Sea.
In the rations also there was a saving. The
diminution in the extravagant expence of
transport tonnage had been very considera-
ble. On his arrival in the Red Sea he had
taken upon himself the management of the
whole of the company's transport tonnage,
and in a short time made a reduction in
the expence to the amount of 17,000l. per
month, which he had followed up till the
saving amounted to 27,000l. He did not
advert to these circumstances as instances
of any great merit on his part; what he
had done was only his bounden duty. He
could not, however, but confess that he
might have been a little extravagant with
respect to his flying sails; but he trusted
an additional expence of a few pounds for
such an object would not be looked upon
as a ground of disapprobation of his con-
duct. He had the testimony of the mar-
quis Wellesley as to his measures of re-
form and retrenchment, together with an
assurance of every assistance to enable him
to continue them. Thus far he had thought
it necessary to state the outlines of his
whole conduct, and, as he had stated at
first, he had no objection to the appoint-
ment of a committee, provided his acqui-
escence should not be construed into an

Sir Home Popham appealed to any learned member in the house, whether he had put a construction on the words which any court of law would not allow. They called upon an inferior officer to rack his memory for any thing during the course of two years that could be brought against the conduct of his captain. He should not deny, and it was what might happen to any officer, that he might have committed some irregularities; but he was sure, he had not been guilty of any criminal irregularities, that could call for, or warrant the criminal industry that had been employed to decry his character. The whole transaction had been submitted to the commissioners of naval enquiry, whose conduct had been so ably argued, and so universally applauded in that house, that he should feel a pride in abiding by the issue of their examination of Mr. Lewis, and in their report thereon to the house. The hon. gent. in his opening speech on this subject, had stated, that he would feel as much pleasure as any hon. gent. if the investigation of the business should be favourable to the person who was the object of it. Nothing could so completely exculpate him from the calumnies that had been propagated against him, as a proof that there was no collusion between him and the naval officer alluded to. On this subject he had written a short and pithy letter to the naval commissioners, calling on them to state, whether, even from inference or mis-admission of the validity of any charge representation, it appeared by the examination of Mr. Lewis, that any collusion existed between himself and that officer. They replied, that they had made their report to VOL. IV.

against him. The report of the committee, he trusted, would be as favourable to his character as he could wish. If he had erred, he had the satisfaction to know, that

2 T

His

he had not erred from principle. He did not to shew great and exemplary merit. mean to say, that ignorance was any jus-merits, he knew, were not confined to that tification of an officer's conduct, but he particular service, but had been displayed was of opinion that that conduct should be on other occasions. The papers were so considered on a great scale, and with a numerous, complicated, and detailed, that just attention to every part of it. He was they could not be advantageously discussed sensible that he was addressing the most li- but in a committee, when it would be proberal and enlightened assembly in the world, per also to consider other collateral matand except the moment that should re-ters. There were various points respectstore him to the service in which being the admiralty and navy boards, and gloried, the moment of referring his the short examination of one single witness whole conduct to their decision was the to which their attention might be directed. happiest of his life. If he had gone too There was likewise the circumstance of the much at length into the particulars, he publication of the report from one board trusted to the indulgence of the house for to another. The loss of the vouchers was having taken up so much of their time and a matter fit for enquiry, as well as the sinattention. gular manner in which an English subject, Colonel Hutchinson said, that as he had an officer of the navy, had been impressed. paid considerable attention to these papers, He should forbear entering into details; it became him to offer a few words. The but all these matters deserved examination, impression which a careful perusal of these and those points should be left open to the papers had made on his mind was, that the committee, for their report to the house. hon. officer had discharged his duty, not As the motion was worded, it did not emonly with great fidelity, but with great abi-brace enough for this purpose, but only lity. He lamented that he was not able to respected the repairs of the Romney and convey in words the strong opinion which Sensible. He should suppose there would he had of his merits. He thought that the be no objection to an amendment to this charges against him were of a very serious effect:-"That the committee should exnature, first, that he had defrauded the amine the matters of the repairs of the public, and then (he was almost ashamed Romney and Sensible, and the proceedings to state it) made use of a false document of the admiralty and navy boards, and comto screen himself. This appeared to him mission of naval enquiry thereon, and also certain, that a very partial investigation enquire into the circumstances of the unbad been made, and very arbitrary pro- authorised publication of Feb. 20, 1804 ; ceedings adopted against the hon. baronet, the loss of the vouchers; and the circumand then that he had been refused permis-stances of impressing Mr. David Evan Barsion to attend, and denied the opportunity to prove his innocence. Whether this was the ordinary practice, he had yet to learn. But if it was not, the persons who had begun it deserved the severest censure. He would vote for this motion, not because he thought that there was a case made out against the hon. officer; on the contrary, he not only was of opinion that he was innocent, but that his conduct was meritorious, but because he thought that many other points in these papers required investigation.

The Chancellor of the Exchequer observed, that as it was likely the house would come to an unanimous vote for the appointment of the committee, he should just remark, that he did so under the impression of similar sentiments with those so forcibly delivered by the hon. member who spoke last. There was nothing contained in those papers from which any imputation of guilt could be drawn against the gallant officer; but, on the contrary, there was much that tended

tholomew; and report to the house, with such observations as arise to them from the consideration of the whole."

Mr. For objected to the word unauthorised, and the chancellor of the exchequer agreed to the omission of it.

Mr. Jeffery (of Poole) said, that the hon. officer, in what he had that night so clearly and eloquently stated, had convinced his mind that he had discharged the important and arduous duty entrusted to him, in such a manner as reflected the highest honour on his zeal, his talents, and his perseverance, and he was happy in the opportunity of paying this small tribute to his merits. He thought, from every thing that he had observed, that the hon. officer was a highly oppressed man. The charges against hini were frivolous, vexatious, and litigious in the highest degree. The whole rested upon about 121. worth of canvass and some oakum, while nothing was said of the great saving he

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