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List of the majority in the commons, on Mr. Whitbread's motion of censure

against lord Melville, April 8, 1805
List of the minority, on ditto



Parliamentary Debates

During the Third Session of the Second Parliament of the

United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland, and of the Kingdom of Great Britain the Nineteenth, appointed to meet at Westminster, the Fifteenth Day of January, 1805, in the Forty-fifth Year of the Reign of King GEORGE the Third.

[Sess. 1805.

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sent parliament; and that the said election Wednesday, March 13, 1805. commenced on the 23d day of July 1904 [MINUTES.] Counsel were heard in at Brentford, in the said county, and that

— continuation, and at great length, relative to tinued open for 15 days; at which said

the poll taken at the said election con. the Scots' Appeal, the earl of Kinnoul and election J. Shaw, esq. and sir W. Leighton, others o. the hon. Mr. Maule and others, kot. were sheriffs and returning officer for viz. Mr. Alexander, as second counsel for the said county; and the petitioners further the appellants, and Mr. Romilly as leading state, that the said sir F. Burdelt, bis agents, counsel on the part of the respondents.

friends, Mr. Alexander brought up from the Com: his behalf, with divers wicked and evil dis

managers, partizans, and others on mons the Mutiny bill, the Additional Salt Duties bill, and the Additional Property bribery and corruption in the election of

posed persons, regardless of the laws against Tax bill.-The bills upon the table were members to serve in parliament, and of the forwarded in their respective stages. pains and penalties of perjury, and subornaAmong these, the Pleasure Horse Duty tion of perjury, and in violation and debill went through a Committee, and was

fiance of the laws and statutes provided for reported : and the bills brought up from the security of the franchises of the real the Commons were severally read a first electors in this kingđom, and intending and time.-Adjourned.

devising to defeat the rights of the real freeholders of the said county of Middlesex,

and to defraud them of their privilege of HOUSE OF

electing a knight to serve in this present Wednesday, March 1S.

parliament for the said county, did com(MIDDLESEX ELECTION.) - Mr. H. bine and confederate together, by means of Thornton presented a petition from G. B. fictitious and pretended voters, to obtain an Mainwaring, esq. sir W. Gibbons, sir W. apparent and colourable majority on the Curtis, H. Thornton, esq. W. Mellish, esq. poll in favour of the said sir F. B.; and by and S. P. Cockerell, esq.; setting forth, ihese and other corrupt and unlawful means, “ That the petitioners now are, and at the to procure the said sir F. B. to be returned time of the last election of a member 10 to serve in this present parliament for the serve in this present parliament for the said county of Middlesex, in opposition to county of Middlesex were, freeholders of the votes of the majority of the real freethe said county, and claim to have had a holders of the said county ; and, in furright to vote at the said election; that at the therance of the said unlawful purpose, did said election sir F. Burdett and the peti- procure great numbers of wicked and evil tioner G. B. Mainwaring, esq. were candi- disposed persons to represent themselves to dates to represent the said county, as a be freeholders of the said county, and to knight of the shire for the same, in this pre, assume the names and descriptions of real VOL. IV,



and amongst

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freeholders of the said county; and did, on admitted to vote at the said election for the every day during the said election, and said sir F. B. who had no right whatever to more particularly on the latter days thereof, vote at the said election,

them send, and procure to be sent, divers of the many persons who had not any colour or said pretended freeholders to Brentford, in pretence of right to vote at the said elecorder to vote for the said sir F. B.; and tion; and did also cause and procure divers that, notwithstanding many of the said persons to personate real freeholders of the persons, so sent and procured to be sent as said county, and in their names to give aforesaid, after they had entered their | their votes for the said sir F. B.; and did names and descriptions on the poll, but be- cause and procure divers persons to vote fore they had completed their votes, were more than once for the said sir F. B. at the detected and exposed by the agents and said election, and to vote for freeholds to inspectors of the petitioner G. B. Main- which they had no right, or pretence of waring, yet that the said sir F.B. his agents, right; and did also cause and procure many friends, partizans, managers, and others'on persons to be admitted to vote for the said his behalf, by various means, arts, and de. sir F. B. who by gifts and rewards, and by vices, did cause and procure great numbers promises,agreements, and securities for gifts of such false, pretended, and fictitious free and rewards, were bribed and corrupted to holders to take, being duly required to take, give their votes for the said sir F. B.; and the freebolder's oath, and the oath against that the said sheriff did permit to vote, and bribery, and did cause and procure the same did receive on the poll, the votes of many persons to be received on the poll, and their persons in favour of the said sir F B. who votes to be entered for the said sir F. B.; had no right to vote at the said election, and and, in furtherance of the said unlawful at said election did reject the votes of many purpose, did cause and procure divers per persons having a right to vote, and who tensons to persobate real freeholders of the said dered their votes at the said election for the county, and in their_names to give their petitioner G.B.Mainwaring, and who ought votes for the said sir F. B.; and did cause to have been received and admitted to vote and procuredivers other persons to vote for at the said election; and that by the aforeand in respect of freeholds, to which they said and other unlawful means the said shehad not any right or pretence of right; and riff did put and place upon the poll 2833 did also cause and procure divers persons votes for the said sir F. B. including therein to vote more than once for the said sir the votes of the before-mentioned 10 perF. B.; and by gifts and rewards, and by sons who had, no right whatever to vote at promises, agreements, and securities for the said election, and whose titles to vote gifts and rewards, did procure divers per were examined into, and to whom the free. sons, as well those who were qualified to holder's oath and the bribery oath were advote as also those who claimed or pretended ministered, and whose votes were placed to have a right to vote at the said election, upon and added to the poll after 3 o'clock and also others who had no pretence or co- on the 15th day of the said election;

and lour to such right, to vote at the said elec- that the said sheriff did admit on the poll tion for the said sir F. B.; and, in fur- for the petitioner 2832 votes, thereby givtherance of the said unlawful purpose, did ing to the said sir F. B. an apparent and coprevail on the said sheriff to receive and lourable majority of one vote on the poll put upon the poll, after 3 o'clock, on the over the petitioner; by means whereof the 15th day of the said election, the votes of said sir F. B. is now wrongfully returned to 10 persons for the said sir F. B. who had no serve in this present parliament as a knight right or title to vote at the said election; of the shire for the said county of Middleand that by these and other unlawful and sex, whereas the petitioner had and hath on corrupt practices, the said sir F.B.his agents, the said poll a large majority of legal votes friends, partizans, managers and others, on of the real freeholders of the said county his behalf, did procure a colourable and over the said sir F. B. and was therefore apparent majority of I vote for the said duly elected a knight of the shire to represir F. B. on the poll over the petitioner G. sent the said county of Middlesex in this B. Mainwaring; and the petitioners further present parliament, and ought to have been

, state, that the said sir F. B. his agents, returned, and ought now to be declared friends, partizans, managers, and others on duly elected instead of the said sir F. B. and his behalf

, did artfully and unlawfully cause the return of sir F. B. ordered to be accordand procure great numbers of persons to be ingly amended and altered; and the peti


tioners further state, that the said sir F. B. of one vote over the petitioner, in manifest by himself, his agents, friends, managers, violation of the rights and privileges of the partizans, and others on his behalf, previous petitioners, and all other the real freeto and at the said election, was guilty of gross holders of the county of Middlesex, whereas and notorious bribery and corruption : and the petitioners alledge, and humbly insist, that at and during the said election, and pre- that the said G. B. N. had a large majority vious thereto, the said sir F. B. by himself, of legal votes at the said election, and ought his agents, friends, managers, partizans, to have been returned accordingly; and and others on his behalf, by gifts and re- therefore praying, that the house will take wards, and promises, agreements, and se- the premises into their consideration, and curities for gifts and rewards, did corrupt will grant to the petitioners such relief, and and procure divers persons, as well those will take such other measures for vindicate who were qualified to vote as those who ing the freedom of election, and the franclaimed or pretended to have a right to vote chises of real freeholders, as to the house at the said election, in their own names, or shall seem meet."-Ordered to be taken in the names of others, or for the freeholds into consideration on the gth of April. of others, to give their votes for him the : (IRISH Budget,)-Mr. Foster moved the said sir F. B.; and did also by gifts and order of the day, for the house resolving itrewards, and promises, agreements, and self into a committee of Ways and Means. securities for gifts and rewards, corrupt and He also moved, that several acts relating to procure divers other persons; being quali- the revenue in Ireland should be referred fied to vote at the said election, to refuse to the said committee; and that it should be and forbear to give their votes at the same an instruction to the committee to consider for the petitioner, contrary to the law and of the said acts. The house having resolved custom of parliament, and the laws and sta- itself into the said committee, the

right hon, tutes of the realm enacted for the preven- gent. rose and spoke as follows ;--Sir, hava tion of bribery and corruption; and the pe- ing detained the committee last year at contitioners further state, that the said sir F. B. siderable length on the subject of the situation by himself, his agents, friends, managers, of Ireland, I shall not now have occasion toga partizans, and others on his behalf and at so much into detail. Ishall begin with a few his charge, after the teste of the writ for observations as to the state of the trade of the said election, and at and during the said Ireland, and I am happy in saying, that alelection, and before the election of the said though the trade has not so much advanced sir F. B. to serve in parliament for the said as I could have wished, yet it is in a far county of Middlesex; did give, present, and better situation than it was some time ago. allow to divers persons who had votes, or A very short statement will elucidate this claimed or pretended to have right to vote position. The imports were to the amount at such election, money, meat, drink, en- of 5,700,000l. last year. The imports for tertainment, and provision, and make pre- the 5 years preceding, were, on an average, sents, gifts, rewards, and entertainments, 5,711,000l. so that in fact, the imports for and make promises, agreements, obliga- the last year is rather less than the average tions, and engagements to give and allow of the former 5 years. The exports amounia money, meat, drink, provision, presents, re-ed to 4,980,0001. last year, which is much wards, and entertainments, to and for such beyond what they have reached at any pepersons having or claiming or pretending to riod during the last 10 years; therefore, the hare right to vote in the said election, and question stands thus: there has been no to and for the use, advantage, benefit, emo- alarming decrease in the imports last year, kument, profit, and preferment of such per- and the exports exceed the amount of the son and persons, in order to his the said sir preceding years. With regard to the exF. B.'s being elected, and that the said sir ports, there is something extremely consoF. B. might be elected to serve in this pre- latory to be remarked. The linen trade has sent parliament for the said county of Mid- increased : during the three quarters of the dlesex, in violation of the standing order last year ending in Oct. the exports were and regulations of the house, and in de within 2 millions of yards of the exports of fiance of the laws and statutes of the realın the whole of the preceding year; therefore for preventing charge and expence in the we may conclude, that the exports of the election of members to serve in parliament; whole of last year will have greatly exand that, by the aforesaid and other corrupt ceeded the exports of former years. In the and unlawful means, the said sir F. B. ob- imports of last year, as compared with the tained an apparent and colourable majority 1 preceding year, there is an excess of some


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of the materials of manufacture; that ex- on the 5th Jan. of the loan of last year, to
cess is on the raw materials only, such as the amount of 738,7891. British, or 800,354).
cotton yarn and cotton wool. With regard Irish, which has not been transmitted to the
to the linen trade, the whole of the excess Irish treasury, and I shall therefore bring it
during the 3 quarters of the last year, com- forward. This comes to 8,508,6871. to
pared with the 3 quarters of the preceding meet a charge of 8,464,983). The next
year, is 3 millions of yards; the principal thing will be to raise the Ways and Means
part of this increase arises from the exports for the interest of 2,500,0001. English, and
to the colonies in the West Indies. Here al- 1,000,000l. Irish.,
low me to remark, that if in laying on taxes On 27 millions, at 6l. 175. 7d. per cent, the
we do not hinder trade and manufactures, British Irish charge is. 172,062 186,400
we do well; and if in taking off taxes we On 1,000,000l. suppose at
promote trade, we do better. Last

the same rate,

68,825 export tax on the linen trade was taken off, and there was an excess of 3 millions of Making in the whole a charge, inyards: so far with respect to trade. We cluding the sinking fund, of £255,255, stand not in the situation we did some years I have stated that. I take the revenues of ago; we are not in a declining way, taken Ireland at 4 millions. I shall now. explain upon a comparisen with former years. The the reason why. They produced last year balance of the imports over the exports for 2,800,0001. The principle I go on is to the last five years, amounts to. 1,195,000l. put the revenues at a full


establisha year, official value. Take the excess of ment, and to raise the additional war exlast year, and it is only 655,0001. so that pences. I suppose that the revenues will the excess of the import over the export produce 1,200,000l. more than last year. trade is not one half of what it has been for It is pleasant to know, that the taxes which the last five years. With respect to the the house thought proper to impose last debt of Ireland, let us see how it has in- year, with the exception of the taxes on creased. I shall not enter into the cause or excise, have operated, in the gross, perthe means of preventing so large an in- fectly to my satisfaction. The whole" re

We can at least shew that we have venues of the country, for the two quarstopped the progress of that increase. In ters ending Midsummer 1804, amount to Jan. 180+, the debt of Ireland was 53 mil- 1,334,0001.; for the two quarters ending lions. The

year before it was only 43 mil 5th Jan. 1805, 1,886,0001. The excess of lions, so that there was an increase that year the two quarters ending 5th January is of 10 millions. The increase now will not 552,0001. more than the excess of the prebe half that amoụnt; so that we may say ceding quarters. Without going into miwe are in a better situation than we were at nutiæ, I state the revenue to have gained by the close of the last year.—Having stated an acquisition of 552,000l. I know that the situation of thie trade and the debt of the duties on the distilleries are not collected Ireland, I will proceed to lay before the as they ought to be. I am well warranted committee the demands, and the Ways and in saying, that if a proper mode of collecta Means for meeting them. The whole charge ing them had been resorted to, they would of the year 1805, for the debt of Ireland, have amounted to considerably more than including the sinking fund, is 2,611,6231. they have done. I am persuaded, that, with The proportion of 2-17ths of the sum raised the addition of the duties on the distilleries, by Ireland for the joint charge for the ser collected as they ought to be, the revenues vice of the year, is 5,403, 1021. British, or of Ireland, in time of peace, will not pro5,853,3601. Trish, making together the sum duce less than 41 millions; stating the inof 8,454,9831

. which is the sum Ireland is terest of the debt at 2 millions, there will to provide to pay the interest of her debt, be. 2 millions over. Now 2 millions. canand her quota of contribution. Certainly not be expended in a peace establishment, it is a very large sum, and one cannot ap- unless 15 millions are expended in England. ply one's attention too much to the means In talking of the collection of the revenues, of lessening it. In order to meet this de- I believe many gentlemen who hear me can mand, I shall take the revenues of Ireland bear testimony, that there is not a city or at 4 millions. I shall explain my reason for county in Ireland where the duties on distaking them at that sum presently. A loan tilleries are perfectly collected; they are not has been settled for 2,500,0001. which is collected in the counties of Galway, Tys 2,708,3331. Irish. A further loan is in- rone, or the province of Connaught. As tended of 1 million. There was a residue, to the city of Dublin, I do not wish to de


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