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And, what is the danger that could possibly | dominions a set of men more sincerely atarise from so doing? We are told that the tached, or better affected to his person and catholics differ from all other sects. You government, than the noblemen and gentlemay endure dissenters, you may

endure men

men who

represent the catholic body in Ireof no religion, but you may not endure the land; but," added the noble earl," these catholics, because they do not acknowledge noblemen and gentlemen have long ceased to the king's supremacy. Great stress has been have any infuence over the great mass of the laid

upon the objection on the part of the Roman catholics in Ireland.” Why then, I petitioners to take this oath; and this very would ask, should we hesitate to grant the circumstance, did no other consideration, ap-, prayer of the petition, which goes to affect a ply, would abundantly and clearly expose comparatively small mumber of persons, and the falsity, inconsistency, and absurdity of who are described as loyal and faithful subthe assertion, that the petitioners hold as an jects, and yet grant to the lower orders of article of their creed, “ that no faith is to be the great body of the Irish catholics, reputkept with heretics." Nothing now, it has edly a contaminated mass, every thing they been observed, in the course of this debate, can reasonably enjoy under the constitution? remains to exclude the catholics from a full The argument of the noble earl involves this participation of the benefits of the constitu- farther inconsistency. He entertains fears tion, but their sanctimonious regard for the that great catholic proprietors would soon dictates of an oath! And yet, up to this very exclusively be returned for the counties, by a hour, we have been told, that catholics con- great majority of the catholic freeholders; sider themselves as not obliged to keep faith and yet, almost in the same breath, he aswith heretics, and, consequently, pay no re- serts, that persons of that description have gard to the oaths they take with them. But ceased to have any influence over the great this is not all. Let your lordships consider body of the Roman catholics! Yet, enterwhat this much talked of oath is in reality taining so high an opinion of these nobleand in fact. Perhaps, many who talk so loudly men and gentlemen, these are they on whom of it, are far from understanding it. In point and on whom alone, you are desirous of of fact, the oath of supremacy, as it now placing these restraints. To presbyterians stands is not positive but negative. It does you give a full participation in the blessings not assert that the king is the supreme head of your constitution. From them you withof the church, but that no foreign prince is hold nothing. Yet, from the catholic no· so to be considered. It has been repeatedly blemen and gentlemen of Ireland you withargried and demonstrated, that the sense in hold every thing. My lords, how can this which the Roman catholics regard the pope be reconciled with any principle of reason or as supreme head of the church, is a theolo- of justice? How can you withhold these gical, not a political consideration.--I shall blessings from men who have risked their not detain your lordships at this late hour lives in defence of their country, and in dewith any further observations. If no other fence of those laws in which they earnestly service is derived from the agitation of this pray to be made joint partakers? You owe question, this good will undoubtedly arise much to the zeal, the loyalty, and the active from it: that after all the letters and pain- exertions of the pro:estants of Ireland, but to plalets which have been written against the no set of men do you owe more than to the catholics, it will be clear to the conviction catholic noblemen and gentry from whom of your lordships, that, from all their profes- you withhold these privileges. I hope I sions and all their declarations, doctrines have have proved, that you have nothing to fear been insisted upon, which were never enter- from granting the prayer of this petition. if tained by the persons to whom they have you have any thing to fear, the way is to give been attributed. The catholics will go from up those distinctions which at present exist. your bar acquitted by the most enlightened The true way to meet that danger is by doing assembly. The question of actual attach- away those distinctions, and firmly uniting ment I will never enter into. But this I those two bodies into one. I trust, I have must say, that with very little exception, also proved, that there is throughout your there has been an almost unanimous agree- empire, no outpost so vulnerable as Ireland, ment, as to the loyalty and attachment of It is an old citadel, whose superstructure that body. The argument of one noble lord; you yourselves have demolished; but as for who spoke early in the debate of this night shelter, at present it attords you none! My (the earl of Buckinghamshire) is inconsis- lords, I have no more to say. I am ashamed tent and absurd in the extreme. The noble at this late hour to have trespassed so long earl sait, thit '? his Majesty had not in his ' upon your time. I do extertain a beliet,


that the force of reason, like the rays of the that the petitioners be heard, by their counsun, is breaking in upon us, and that the day sel, before the said committee, upon their is not far distant, when she will triumph over petition, if they think fit. Ordered, that it all prejudices, and will produce a decision be an instruction to the said committee, that favourable to the cause of your petitioners. I they do admit counsel to be heard, at the am persuaded, that the agitation of this ques: same time, in favour of the said bill, against tion will be of service, that an impression the said petition.—On the motion of Mr. will be made on the minds of the catholics Rose, the house, in a committee, went that there is a growing desire to examine through the bill for regulating the office of their case, and that whatever degree of pre- paymaster of the forces. The report was judice may still prevail amongst us, there is brought up, and ordered to be taken into Devertheless, so much liberality, that the ca- consideration on Monday.-Mr. Western tholics will retire from your bar confident of proposed that all gentlemen upon the corn ultimate success.

committee should have votes, which was Lord Sidmouth rose to say a few words by agreed to.-Admiral Markham gave notice, way of explanation. It was his idea, as well that on Wednesday he should move for the as his wish, that all remaining restrictions on naval papers, of which he had given a prethe relgion of the catholics of Ireland, if any vious intimation.Ordered, that the order did remain, should be removed. He would of the day, for the house to resolve itself into also allow them a full community of civil a committee of the whole house, to consider rights with the rest of his majesty's subjects; of the report which was made from the combut never would he agree to put into their mittee to whom the petition of the master, hands powers sufficient to subvert the con- wardens, freemen and commonalty, of the stitution.

mystery of vintners of the city of London, The house then divided, when the num- under their common seal, was referred, be bers were,

now read: and the same being read; it was For the motion. Contents 37 resolved, that this house will, to-morrow, Proxies

resolve itself into the said committee.-Or

49 dered, that the order of the day, for the house Against the motion. Contents 133 to resolve itself into a committee of the

Proxies 45 whole house, upon the bill for repealing so

178 much of an act, made in the 34th year of

his present majesty, as exempts slate, the Majority against the motion

129 value whereof shall not exceed twenty shil

lings per ton, brought coastwise within six o'clock on Tuesday morning the Great Britain, from the duty thereby granthouse adjourned.

ed, be now read: and the same being read ; the house resolved itself into the said committee; and, afto some time spent therein,

Mr. Speaker resumed the chair; and Mr. Monday, May 13.

Alexander reported from the committee, [Minutes]-A petition of several persons that they had gone through the bill, and interested in British ships and vessels fre-made several amendments thereunto, which quenting and trading to the port of London, they had directed him to report, when the was presented to the house, and read; ta- house will please to receive the same. Orking notice of the bill to repeal two acts, dered, that the report be received to-morpassed in the 6th and 32d years of his late row. The order of the day being read, for majesty, for the regulation of lastage and the house to resolve itself into a committee ballastage in the river Thames, and to make of the whole house, upon the bill for making more effectual regulations relating thereto; more effectual provision for the supplying of and setting forth, that the same contains se- cities and market towns in Ireland with waveral clauses and provisions which, if passed ter; resolved, that this house will, to-morinto a law, would be very injurious to the row, resolve itself into the said committee. petitioners; and therefore praying, that they - Ordered, that the order of the day, for the may be heard, by counsel, against so much second reading of the bill for granting to his of the said bill as affects them, and that the majesty certain additional staip duties, fos same may not pass into a law as it now amending the laws relating to the stamp du„stands. Ordered, that the said petition be ties, and for indemnifying persons who have referred to the consideration of the commit- facted as notaries public, without being duly tee to whom the said bill is committed ; and licensed in Ireland, be now read: and the





same being read; the said bill was read a se- a defence naturally increases the fear that cond time, and committed to a committee of peculation in the expenditure of the public the whcle house, for to-morrow.-A peti- money is not contined to the naval departtion of Sir T. S. M. Stanley, bart. was pre- ment; and that the petitioners have long sented to the house, and read; taking notice submitted to severe privations, in the persuaof the bill for improving the passage between sion that they were necessary to the welfare the town of Liverpool and the county of and safety of the country, and they claim, as Chester, at the Rock Ferry, on the river their right, that the money which is liberally Mersey, and for levying tolls on vessels using granted shall be legally applied; and that the the same ; and setting forth, that the peti- petitioners look with a confident hope to the tioner and his ancestors have for time im- house, after their votes of the 8th and 10th memorial been seised of an ancient and very days of April last, that, as constitutional valuable ferry on the Cheshire side of the guardians of their liberty and property, they said river Mersey, called Eastham Ferry; and will neither be deterred nor diverted from a in case the piers, slips, and quays, in the full and impartial enquiry into all abuses, in said bill mentioned, are made and extended whaterer department they may exist; and in the manner thereby proposed, the peti- that the enquiry now begun will not cease, tioner may be greatly prejudiced, and the until all abuses in every public board be reprofits of the said ferry considerably dimi- medied, since so only will the minds of the nished; and therefore praying, that he may petitioners be satisfied, the credit of the gobe heard, by his counsel, or agents, against vernment be upheld, and that free constituthe said bill, and that the same may not pass tion be preserved inviolate, which is the sa: into a law. Ordered, that the said petition cred birthright of Englishmen; and that do lie upon the table, until the report be re- lord viscount Melville, having been declared ceived from the committee to whom the said guilty of a high misdemeanour, by the vote bill is committed ; and that the petitioner be of the house of the 8th of April last, a civil then heard, by his counsel, or agents, against action is inadequate to the end proposed, and the said bill, upon his petition, if he thinks fit. in itself incapable of satisfying the demands

[PETITION FROM CORNWALL RESPECTING of public justice.” Qrdered to lie upon the THE TENTH NAVAL REPORT.- A petition of table. the gentlemen, clergy, freeholders, and in- [PETITION FROM COVENTRY RESPECTING habitants, of the county of Cornwall, was THE TENTH NAVAL REPORT.]--A petition of presented to the house, and read; setting the principal inhabitants of the city and counforth, " that the abuses in the expenditure ty of the city of Coventry, was presented to of the public money, which have been lately the house, and read; setting forth; “ that it brought to light by the commissioners of na- appears to the petitioners, from the tenth val enquiry, have filled the minds of the pe- report' of the commissioners of naval entitioners with alarm and indignation, and quiry, and by the votes of the house of the they call upon the house for the speedy re- 8th and 10th days of April last, decisions medy of such abuses, and for the exemplary which have excited the highest veneration punishment of the offenders, and that and gratitude in their breasts, that there has abuses in the expenditure of the public mo- been the most gross and scandalous misappliney (at all times matter of grievance) are pe- cation of the public money in the office of fuliarly felt at this time, when so great a lord viscount Melville, with his privity weight of taxation falls upon all ranks of and connivance; and the petitioners deempeople; and that a defence las been at- ing it highly essential to the detection of fur tempted of the guilt of the offenders, by the thermal-practices, that every department of assertion that no actual mischief has been government should undergo a strict and imsustained by these gross breaches of trust and partial scrutiny, and that every delinquent offences against law, as if the direct violation may be brought to exemplary punislınent, of a statute were not a high crime and mis- humblý intreat that the powers so wisely and demeanour without the aggravation, that the judiciously by the house intrusted to the violation of which the petitioners complain said commissioners, and by tiem so ably, was systematic, and committed by a conti uprightly, and indefatigably employed, may dential servant of the crown, himself the be continued, or, if thought necessary, furn framer of the act which he has broken, and ther extended.” Ordered to lie upon the table. enjoying an incizased salary under that very [PETITION FROM ESSEX RESPECTING THE act, in full satisfaction of all wages and fees, TENTH NAVAL KEPORT.

RT.].- A petition of the and other profits and emoluments theretofore noblemen, and the humble petition of the enjoyed by former treasurers; and that şuch gentlemen, clergy, and freebiders, of the

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county of Essex, convened by the high she the subject matter of their message to the siff, at Chelmsford, the 28th day of May, lords, on Friday, the 3d day of this instant 1805, was presented to the house, and read; May, desiring that their lordships will give setting forth, " that the petitioners humbly leave to lord viscount Melville to come to feel, that it is no less their duty tha: their the select committee of this house, to whom earnest wish and desire, to offer their warın- the tenth report of the commissioners of est thanks to the house for their decisions naval enquiry (respecting the office of the on the 8th and 10th of April last, whereby treasurer of his majesty's navy) stands rethey so clearly demonstrated, and justly cen- ferred, in order to be examined at that com. sured, the gross violation of law, and breach 'mittee." And then the messengers withdrew, of public duty, committed by lord viscount –Resolved, that this house doth agree to a Melville whilst he held the office of trea- conference with the lords, as is desired by surer of bis majesty's navy; and the peti- their lordships.' And the messengers were tioners further beg leave to express the sa- again called in ; and Mr. Speaker acquainted tisfaction they feel in witnessing, by subse- them therewith. And then they again withquent votes of the house, their determina- drew.-Ordered, that a committee be: aption of prosecuting enquiries into all other pointed to manage the said conference. And violations of law and abuses of public trust, a committee was appointed accordingly: which may have existed in any other de- Then the names of the managers were called partment of the public expenditure; and over; and they went to the conference, and ihat, in the present situation of the empire, being returned; Mr. Leycester reported, engaged in a war of unparalleled expense that the managers had met the lords at

“ and difficulty, the petitioners feel, that it is the conference, which was managed on the essentially necessary to insure the strictest part of the lords by the Duke of Norfolk ; application of the national resources to the and that the conference was to acquaint this great and important objects for which they house ; that the lords, always desirous that are called forth; that they entertain the a good intelligence and right understanding fullest persuasion, and it is their earnest wish should be maintained betwixt the two houses, and prayer, that the house will exercise that and persuaded that nothing can tend more control over the management of the public effectually thereunto than a close adherence money which in their wisdom may appear to the ancient and regular methods of pronecessary; that they will persevere in those ceeding between the two houses, have demeasures which they have already begun; sired this conference upon the subject matter and that they will establish a system of just of the message sent by the house of comand prudent economy in every branch of the mons for leave for the lord viscount Melville public receipt and expenditure.” Ordered to attend the select committee of that house tɔ lie upon the table.

in order to be examined, to communicate to [LORD MELVILLE.]“A message was de- the house of commons ;—that it appears livered from the , lords stating, “ that the undeniably, by an uniform series of precelords do give leave to the lord Harrowby to dents down to the present time, that the come to the select committee of the house course adopted by the lords, respecting the of commons, to whom the tenth report of giving leave to the members of their lordthe commissioners of naval enquiry (respect- ship's house to go down to the house of coming the office of the treasurer of his majesty's mons, has been to permit the members of navy) is referred, to enquire into the ap- their lordship’s house, on their own request, plication of any monies issued to the trea- to defend themselves in the house of consurer of the navy for naval services to pur- mons, if they think fit, on any points on poses not naval, and whether any, and what which that house has not previously passed representations were made to the lords com- any accusatory or criminating resolutions missioners of his majesty's treasury, or the against them; and also, to permit the menzchancellor of the exchequer, respecting the bers of their lordship’s ho!ise, on the request withdrawing from the bank any sums of of the house of commons, to give evidence, money so issued since the passing of the act if they think fit, before that house, or any of 25 Geo. III. c. 31; and also into the committee thereof, on those points only on proceedings had for the recovery of the debt which no matter of accusation or charge is due to the crown by the late Adam Jellicoe; at that time in any manner depending against in order to be examined at that committee, them before that house, w:ether the same if his lordship thinks fit ;” and also, “ that shall then have been resolved by the house of the lords do desire a present conference with conimons or not.—That the lords had also dithis house, in the painted chamber, upon rected them to acquaint the house of com,

mons, that their lordships, relying with the order of the day being read for taking into most perfect confidence that the house of consideration the Petition of the Roman Cacommons are at all times as desirous to pre- tholics of Ireland, and the petition itself (see serve the privileges of the lords as to main- p.97) being also read by the clerk, tain their own, have given leave to lord Mr. Fox rose and spoke as follows : Sir, viscount Melville (who had also previously at the same time that I cannot help feeling made it his own unqualified request) to go a considerable degree of anxiety at being down to the select committee of the house about to bring before the house a subject of commons, to whom the tenth report of which, according to my conception of it, the commissioners of naval enquiry (respect- seems, in its probable consequences, some ing the office of the treasurer of his majesty's nearer and some more remote, to be of the navy) is referred, to enquire into the appli- very highest importance; yet, I confess, I cation of any monies issued to the treasurer feel infinitely less agitated than upon many of the navy for naval services to purposes other subjects on which I have lately had not naval, and whether any and what re- occasion to address you. It is certainly a presentations were made to the lords com- sort of recreation, if I may be allowed so to missioners of his majesty's treasury, or the express myself, after having been obliged to chancellor of the exchequer, respecting the perform the harassing duties of accusation; withdrawing from the bank any sums of after having promoted enquiries into circummoney so issued since the passing of the act stances, certainly not more honourable to of 25 Geo. III. c. 31 ; and also, into the the country at large than to the individual proceedings had for the recovery of the debt concerned in them; after having had my due to the crown by the late Adam Jellicoe ; mind so harassed and occupied, - to feel that in order to be examined at that committee, I am not now the mover of accusation, but if he shall so think fit, his lordship, never that I am pleading the cause of my fellow theless, conforming himself in all respects subjects, and that I am endeavouring to add to the course directed to be communicated to the strength of the country, without takto the commons as above."

ing from the credit, power, or authority of [PETITION FROM OXFORD RESPECTING any living man in he empire. I cannot THE PETITION OF THE ROMAN CATHOLICS help being sensible' of the contrast between OF IRELAND.]—A petition of the mayor, the duties lately imposed upon me, and that bailiffs, and commonalty, of the city of Ox- of attempting to draw the attention of the

common council assembled, was house to a subject, which, however 'empresented to the house, and read; setting barrassing the discussions of it may be to forth, “ that the petitioners having seen, some persons, has at least this advantage, by the votes of the house, that a petition has that it rests entirely on principles of general been introduced there from certain Roman affection and good wili, connected with views catholics of Ireland, on behalf of themselves which every man must approve, and no and others, professing the Roman catholic man can condemn. The question, sir, that religion, complaining of divers restraints and I have the honour of bringing before you, incapacities to which they are subject, by and I do feel it a great honour to have been the statutes now in force against them, and desired to bring it before you, is no less praying to be relieved therefrom; the pe- than a petition, signed not indeed by any titioners pray the house, that the several very great number of persons, but embracing, statutes constituting and establishing those and I take it at the lowest calculation, when restraints and incapacities, of which the said I say, one-fifth of his majesty's subjects. petition complains, may be preserved in- Nay, further, I believe I shall not be incorviolate, inasmuch as those statutes appear to rect, if I state them at one-fourth of the whole have been devised, by the wisdom of cur of his majesty's subjects in Europe. My ancestors, as the best and surest means of duty, therefore, calls upon me to plead the giving permanency and security to the pro- cause of 3 or 4 millions of the people of testant government of this country in church Ireland, without reference to the proportion and state, and as, in the firm belief of the they bear to the population of that part of petitioners

, the same, or equally as strong, the empire, but which must be allowed to reasons now exist for the continuance of contain the greater proportion of the catholic those statutes as when they were enacted.” subjects of his majesty—a proportion amount-Ordered, that the said petition do lie upon ing to nearer a fourth than a fifth of the

whole population of the empire. I feel (ROMAN CATHOLIC PETITIOx.]-The particularly fortunate, that when I am

ford, in


the table.

* 3 H

Vol. IV.

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