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in reply to MR. HOOPER by a reference to Halli- have been "Vicentini," which would be more conwell, voc. "Dunstable.' It is just possible that gruous. ALEX, BEAZELEY. MR. HOOPER may have confused Downright Dunstable" with another expression, perhaps with that which I am about to mention. Some years ago I was told by a lady, native of the place, that the by-name of Deddington, a small market town and parish six miles south of Banbury, the cake town, was "Drunken Deddington." Probably this eke-name is still green. F. ADAMS.

105, Albany Road, Camberwell, S.E.

I am not aware of an authority for "Downright Dunstable" meaning drunk. But "As plain as Dunstable by-way" is quite ancient, from which it seems to have an opposite sense :

"These men walked by walkes, and the sayyinge is many biwalkes, many balker, manye balkes muche stumblynge, and where much stumblynge is, there is sometime a fal, howbeit ther were some good Walkers among them, that walked in the Kynges highe waye ordinarilye, vprightlye, playne Dunstable waye, and for thys purpose, I woulde shewe you an hystorye which is written in the thyrde of the kynges" (1 Kings i. and ii., note).-Latimer's 'Seven Sermons,' 1549, Arber,

p. 56.

There is a reference to this in Hazlitt's 'English Proverbs,' 1882, with more in illustration. This is a book with which contributors seem to me not be so familiar as one might expect.

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I may be wrong in assuming that "Downright Dunstable means bacchi plenus, but the passage on which I based my opinion seems to justify it. Here it is :

"A merry Bottle is Meat, Drink and Cloaths; For my part. I have wound up my Bottom, the Wine is got into my Pericranium; I am down-right Dunstable."

This is from "Petronius Arbiter. Made English by Mr. Wilson and others, sold at The Raven, Pater-noster-row, 1708." JAMES HOOPER.


"It [Downright Dunstable] is applied to things plain and simple, without either welt or guard to adorn them, as also to matters easy and obvious to be found without any difficulty or direction. Such this road; being broad and beaten, as the confluence of many leading to London from the north and north-west parts of this land."Fuller's Worthies.'


13, Wolverton Gardens, Hammersmith, W.

In this connexion the following verse may be worth noting. I heard it from one of our servants in Rome, in 1843:

Veneziani, gran' signori ;
Padovesi, gran' dottori;
Varesini, mangia' gatti;
Veronesi, tutti matti.

I quote from memory; but the only place-name I am at all uncertain about is that in the third line. Varese is an insignificant place to be bracketed with the cities mentioned. It may

The lines on these parishes used to run:-
Beggarly Bisley, strutting Stroud,
Mincing Hampton, and Tetbury proud,
Of what Tetbury was supposed to be proud I
C. S.
cannot say.

'ANTAGONISM' (8th S. iii. 228).-The lecture on Antagonism' to which L. refers was delivered at the Royal Institution on April 20, 1888, by Lord Justice Grove.

B. W. S.

JOHN LISTON (8th S. iii. 143, 216).-In 1831, by the chance introduction of James Prescott Warde, the actor, I had a bowing acquaintance with Liston. At that period he lived in one of the two low-built houses, with square plate-glass windows, adjoining to St. George's Hospital, and was, with his wife, a most constant attendant at the Chapel Royal at St. James's, where he had two sittings under the permission of William IV. He dressed rather conspicuously, in nankin trousers and waistcoat, laurel-green coat with gilt buttons, pink silk hose, shoes with large bows of broad black ribbon, and a white hat. As on Sundays, on his way to the Chapel Royal, he carried a large quarto Prayer Book, bound in red morocco, under his arm, he was the object of general attention. It was well known that he had been supercargo on board a merchantman_before he became an actor. HUGH OWEN, F.S.A.

"COMMENCED M.A." (8th S. iii. 8, 57, 155).— Does not this expression refer to the fact that there were two steps necessary to complete taking the M.A. degree? Bachelors might be admitted ad incipiendum in artibus at any time after three years from the completion" of their B.A. degree. They were then called inceptors, and they became complete Masters of Arts by creation on Commencement day. Non-resident Bachelors certainly only make one visit to Cambridge in order to take their Master's degree. But when I was an undergraduate (1857-61) Bachelor fellows at the end of their third year used to appear in chapel without their Bachelor's hood for some weeks, and were supposed to be "commencing M.A." They had ceased to be Bachelors, but were not full Masters.

It should be remembered that though the M.A. degree could be taken at any time after three years from the B.A. degree, such Masters of Arts had not their full privileges of voting, &c., until the Commencement day. W. D. SWEETING.

Maxey, Market Deeping.

The word "Commencement" is universally used in the United States to mark the close of the academic or collegiate year. At such times the programmes, &c., usually bear the heading of

"Commencement Exercises." I have heard it
accounted for as indicating that now the real work
of life commences for the graduates.

Dover as a seat of the old trade in slaves from England; but the following extract is given, from "the_contemporary biography of Wulfstan, who was Bishop of Worcester at the time of the Conquest," relating to Bristol :

In the American colleges and universities the day at the end of term, on which occasion the "Com"There is a sea-port town called Bristol, opposite to degrees are conferred, &c., is known as Ireland, into which its inhabitants make frequent voyages mencement." And even the schools of this on account of trade. Wulfstan cured the people of this country, primary and advanced, which hold closing town of a most odious and inveterate custom, which they exercises (as most of them do) dignify these exer- derived from their ancestors, of buying men and women cises with the name "Commencement," which in all parts of England, and exporting them to Ireland appears to show a gross misapprehension of the for the sake of gain. The young women they commonly significance of the term, as indicated by MR. with child, and carried them to market in their pregnancy, that they might bring a better price. You might have seen with sorrow long ranks of young persons of both sexes, and of the greatest beauty, tied together with ropes, and daily exposed to sale; nor were these men ashamed, O horrid wickedness! to give up their nearest relations, nay, their own children, to slavery."Wharton's 'Anglia Sacra,' ii, 258.

At the larger colleges the functions connected with graduation may extend over several days, sometimes a week, in which case it is known as "Commencement" week.

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New Brighton, N.Y., U.S. It is stated the principal purchasers of the slaves "ITS" (8th S. iii. 147).-In reply to D. C. T."were probably the Danes, or Ostmen (that is I am happy to be able to offer him some confirma- Eastern men), as they were called" who tion of his date for the appearance of "its." In masters of nearly the whole line of the coast" of my glossary to Ben Jonson's works (unfortunately Ireland opposite to Britain. The slaves which still in manuscript) I have noted "its, first appear-attracted the attention of St. Augustine in Rome, ance? Epicene,' ii. 3." This reference was to at an earlier period, would probably be sent from Cunningham's Globe edition of Gifford's 'Ben Dover or its neighbourhood. Jonson' (vol. i. p. 421). "Its" occurs three times there, its knees," "its fees," and "its diet." There are eleven uses of "it" in the same passage, chiefly "it knighthood," where we would say "its," showing that this was a transitional period. The date of this text of the play is that of the first folio of Ben Jonson, 1616, which is the very date in question. 'Epicene' appeared in quarto several times from 1609 to 1616, but I have never seen a copy, and I cannot find one in Dublin. I have referred to the folio, and find "it's," printed with the apostrophe however, recurring as quoted above,

and the same in the folio of 1640.

H. CHICHESTER HART. P.S.-Does the above tend to show that we owe "its" to Ben Jonson?

I am afraid I cannot throw any additional light upon D. C. T.'s query; but it may be worth while to point out that, although this word is found in one place in the Authorized Version of the Bible, it must not be supposed that it stood there in the original edition of 1611. As is noted in the margin of the Revised Version, the reading there was "it," the passage (Leviticus xxv. 5) standing which groweth of it own accord." Was this accidental, or are there instances of "it" being used where we should now say "its"? If so, "it" may in such sentences have grown into "its" of its own accord. W. T. LYNN.



THE DOVER SLAVE TRADE (8th S. iii. 109).
In the History of British Commerce,' by Geo. L.
Craik, M.A. (1844), there is no special mention of

Either your contributor MR. JOSEPH COLLINSON or Dr. Cunningham is wrong. I am sure the Dover slave market referred to is that in New Hampshire, United States, America.

J. P. E.

EY ABBEY (8th S. iii. 129).—Ey in Suffolk. The early edition of Tanner (Ox., 1695) has this short

notice of it :

"A priory of Benedictines founded by Robert Malet

(temp. Will. Conq.) and commended to the patronage of

St. Peter. It was a cell to Bernay in Normandy, but Richard II. made it Prioratus indigena, and so it continued till the Suppression, at which time it was rated at 1611. 28. 3d. per an. Dugd: 184l. 9s. 7d. ob. Speed. Vide 'Mon. Angl.,' t. i. p. 356. Reg. Pones Th. Dey de Eya. Gen.”—P. 210.

There are transcripts of the Chartulary in the British Museum, Add. MS. 8178; Arund. MS. ED. MARSHALL. 921 (Sims).

MR. WALLER will find much curious matter relating to Eye, in Suffolk, in Mr. J. Cordy Jeaffreson's report on the MSS. of the Corporation of Eye, printed in appendix, part iv. to the tenth Report of the Hist. MSS. Com., 1885. following probably refer to the building inquired



(a.) "24 Edward I. Note that Edmund Cornubie took the keeping of the Priory of Eye, after the death of Richard the late Prior."

(e.) "7 Edward II. Inquisitio made by Peter Burgati and others, with return, that Robert Mallett founded the priory of Eye with his lands and possessions, &c., and the same priory is so subject' Abbacie de Berniaco in Nor

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ALTAR (8th S. iii. 168).—Without at all wishing to give offence to the numerous readers and contributors of N. & Q.,' or tread upon polemical corns, let me say that the term " altar," as applied to the communion table, cannot in some instances, at any rate, be considered as objectionable. For instance, What better or more fitting term than altar-piece could be applied to many fine paintings at the eastern end of many churches, both on the Continent and in England? Notably in Oxford there are two fine specimens of them, as the "Noli me tangere" at All Souls' College, by Raffaelle Mengs, and Christ bearing the Cross,' at Magdalen College, said to be by Moralez, or Morales, a Spanish artist. The most singular one I ever saw was at Manchester Cathedral, many years ago, when a fine piece of tapestry did duty as an altar-piece representing the offerings of the early Christians and the death of Ananias and Sapphira. But this has long since departed. There used to be an old book entitled 'Companion to the Altar,' in the frontispiece of which Queen Anne was represented kneeling. The Morning Post used to speak, also, in former years, of going, or leading, to "the hymeneal altar." JOHN PICKFORD, M.A. Newbourne Rectory, Woodbridge.

As our Prayer Book never used this word, which Laud introduced, Archbishop Williams, of York, wrote against him a book addressed to the incumbent "of Gr." (Grantham), insisting that the Lord's Table should be called a table, and "placed tablewise," i. e., not used while standing against an east wall, "like a dresser or a sideboard," but brought out into the middle of the church, and set lengthwise, so that the priest might stand on its north side, facing the light, and be best seen of the people. When out of use, it was to be carried back to the east (or any convenient) wall.

E. L. G.

TITUS OATES (6th S. ix. 445; 7th S. xii. 209; 8th S. iii. 156). On this subject I would remark that Titus Oates, the " "plot" man, was baptized at Hastings (and probably born there too) in 1619, which puts his birth thirty years later than the date given by A. T. M. officiated as curate of All Saints', Hastings, in 1671. His father was rector of that parish from

1660 to 1683.




Thomas Ward-commonly known as Tom Ward -a dirty writer of the earlier part of the last century-has in his writings (the four-volume edition) a paper on Titus Oates having married a Muggle

tonian widow. I cannot give a more complete
reference, for I have not the book by me.

127).—The Latin form of this proverb is in Pliny,
N. H.,' viii. 16. The Greek form in the collec-
tions of proverbs is ἀεὶ φέρει τι Λιβύη κακόν.
See Gaist., 'Paroëm. Græc.,' Oxon., 1832, pp. 6,
108, 266. At the last of these references there is
a note from Schottus, which mentions the line of
Anaxilas, in Athenæus, lib. xiv. p. 623, and the
use of it by Aristotle, Hist. An.,' 1. viii. c. 28.
But Anaxilas and Aristotle in this place appear
to have kalvóv for the kakóv of the proverb writers.
Büchmann, 1892, also refers to Aristotle, 'De
Generatione An.' ii. 5, where, too, it is kalvóv.

Stephen Gosson has the following variant of this expression in 'The Ephemerides of Phialo,' an extract from the commencement of which work is given in Arber's reprint of 'The Schoole of Abuse (1579), pp. 62–3, 1868:—

"This Doctour of Affrike with a straunge kinde of style begins to write thus: To his frinds the Plaiers, and to win eare, at the first like a perfect Orator, he sittes down in his study, lookes about for his bookes, takes pen in hand, and as manerly as he can, breathes out this oracle from the threefooted-stoole of Pythia Affrica There is euer a new semper aliquid apportat noui, knack in a knaues hood, or some kind of monster to be sene in Affrik." F. C. BIRKBECK TERRY.

CUE: "TO TAKE ONE'S CUE FROM " (8th S. iii. 187).-I cannot answer DR. MURRAY's first query, but as to the second I can testify, from my own practical experience on the stage and knowledge of the stage, that no MS. or play is ever marked with Q, or qu, or cue-and I have examined and read hundreds of plays, ancient and modern. cue is always understood, and is, of course, last three or four words of the last speech given When a new part by the last speaker, i.e. actor.




is given to an actor to learn, or "study," as be would term it, each cue is written in and underscored with red ink, for him to learn, as well as his own "cackle," or words," as the text of his part is technically called. As a student of the drama and dramatic literature, I should not have failed to note a thing so curious as "Q, a note of entrance for actors," &c., had I come across it. (I may add, in parenthesis, that I have written on the subject of stage terms and slang in a work published in 1890.) Butler and Minsheu must have drawn upon their imagination for their statements. I have always understood that the English word came from the French queue. As to the familiarity of the use of cue or amongst players, I may state that which must be obvious, i.e., that it is a common habit in the green-room, or at the wings, to say, "What's my cue?" "Ah! that's

my cue." Would not this account for its being
well known to Strype? Actors proverbially use
stage terms off the boards as well as on.
S. J. ADAIR Fitz-Gerald.

THE HOLY THORN (8th S. iii. 125, 177).—This variety is by no means uncommon. Indeed, it is so well known as not to be considered even a provincial term. Britten gives it (Dict. Plant Names,' E. D.S.) as Crataegus oxyacanthus præcox. The writer had a very old one in his garden, which used to be watched at about Christmas time. It nearly always put forth a sort of half-developed spurious blossom in the depth of winter, which sometimes in mild seasons might fairly be called flower; but there was no appearance of leaf, and the winter blossom never matured. In April or May it blossomed freely, like other whitethorns, and bore the usual crop of berries (haws). By the peasantry it is always called the "Holy Thorn," while the "gentry" know it as the "Glastonbury Thorn." It certainly was not imported "some years ago from Palestine," for the tree above referred to was probably a hundred years old.


The holy thorn of Glastonbury, which was planted by St. Joseph of Arimathea from a thorn taken from our Lord's brow, was so highly reverenced that slips from it became a constant article of merchandize in foreign countries, and it used to be said that there was scarcely a gentleman's park in Somerset which did not contain a plant grown from a slip of the Glastonbury Thorn. It may therefore well have spread into other counties of England. In my young days Mr. Lee Lee's park of Dillington, near Ilminster, possessed one of these, and the cattle knelt down to it every Old Christmas Eve (Epiphany), as was devoutly believed. This, nearly fifty years ago, was gravely adduced to me as a reason that the New Style must be wrong.


St. Saviour's, Southwark. Since records of the holy thorn and its flowering vagaries seem likely enough to be kept in 'N. & Q., I will add to other instances one tree that I have lately learnt was in the habit of blooming near London not so very long ago. The neighbourhood was Walham Green-and none who only know what a very unsavoury kind of locality this spot is now would believe, perhaps, what a pretty suburb it was about thirty years ago—and the garden in which the thorn grew belonged to the house of the late Lord Ravensworth, built originally by John Ord, once M.P. for Midhurst, and afterwards a Master in Chancery. Ord was a great horticulturist, and, among other things, possessed a holy thorn, which flowered on Christmas Day, 1793, and the second edition of Lyson's Environs of London' contains, I am told, a description of its doing so. Mean

while, if any local reader of 'N. & Q.' should wish
to know where this house stood, he may be directed
to the spot, almost immediately opposite the Wal-
ham Green Police Station.

Barnes Common.

CHARLES STEWARD, OF BRADFORD-ON-AVON (2nd S. vi. 327, 359; 8th S. iii. 154, 195).—I think I can give a slight clue to the parentage of Cloudesley Stewart, mentioned by VERNON. He was probably a descendant of "James Stewart, a naval officer killed in battle" (third son of Capt. Andrew Stewart, who died 1650, ancestor of the Stewarts of Athenry), who is said to have married a daughter of Rear-Admiral Sir Cloudesley Shovel. It is not unlikely that a son or grandson may have been named Cloudesley. Admiral Shovel (who died 1707) seems to have had two other daughters and coheirs: Elizabeth, married first, 1708, first Lord Romney; secondly, 1724, third Earl of Hyndford; and Anne, married Hon. Robert Mansel, and was mother of second Lord Mansel, of Margam. From the dates it seems likely that James Stewart's wife was older than either of these daughters, and she may have been the issue of a previous marriage. I have many notes on the name of Stewart in connexion with the West Indies, but none for Nevis, and can give no information about any marriage between Stewart and Pym.


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Of best things then what world shall yield confection To liken her? Shakesp. No answer was returned. I have just now found it in Arcadia,' book i., the eclogue of Thyrsis and Dorus. Clearly he quoted from memory. What a memory the man had !—and how careless he sometimes was in trusting it. C. B. MOUNT.

TRUMBULL (8th S. ii. 527; iii. 98, 154).-Col. John Trumbull, painter, born Lebanon, Ct., June 6, 1756; died New York, November 10, 1843; Harvard University, 1773; son of Rev. Jonathan Trumbull; retired from army, 1777; resided in London as pupil of West, the painter; imprisoned eight months in retaliation for André's execution. He painted 'Battle of Bunker's Hill' in 1786, the Death of Montgomery soon after, and in 1788 the 'Sortie of the Garrison of Gibraltar,' now in the Boston Athenæum. In 1789-93 he was in the United States painting the portraits for his historical pictures, the 'Declaration of Independence,' 'Surrender at Saratoga,' 'Surrender of Cornwallis,' and the 'Resignation of Washington at Annapolis,' which now adorn the rotunda of the capitol at Washington. In 1792 he painted the portrait of

Washington, representing him meditating his retreat the evening before the battle of Princetown. The Trumbull Gallery at Yale College contains fiftyseven pictures by him, presented to that institution in consideration of an annuity of a thousand dollars. Besides the above-named are 'Battle of Trenton,' 'Surrender of the Hessians at Trenton,' 'Death of Mercer,''The Woman taken in Adultery,' "Suffer little children to come unto me," copies of old masters, &c. See Trumbull's Autobiography,' New York, 8vo. 1841. LEO CULLETON.

THE GOOD DEVIL OF WOODSTOCK (8th S. iii. 168). The authorities for the scenes at the Manor House are these:

Two original pamphlets, containing an account of the several exhibitions, which were seen by Sir Walter Scott at the British Museum in 1832 ('Woodstock'). One of these, a composition in verse, is printed as appendix i. of the Abbotsford edition.

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The Authentic Memoirs of Joseph Collins of Oxford,' taken from a MS. forming the subject of an article in the British Magazine for 1747, and a notice in Hone's 'Every Day Book.'

The 'Relation'in Plot's 'Oxfordshire,' from contemporary authority, ch. viii. §§ 38-45.

This narrative in Plot is a counterpart of 'The Just Devil of Woodstock: or a True Narrative of the Several Apparitions,' &c., by Thomas Widdowes, Minister of Woodstock, 1749 (but "printed in Decemb. 1660," Wood).

A letter written by John Lydell, M. A., to Mr. Aubrey, in Aubrey's Miscellanies,' s.a., p. 82. ED. MARSHALL.

I do not know where the genuine 'History of the Good Devil of Woodstock, &c., is to be found, but a very full account of the strange doings at the King's House, Woodstock, to which Joe Collins so largely contributed, appears in the third volume of A Collection of Curious Articles from the Gentleman's Magazine,' under the title of a 'Remarkable Anecdote from Plot's History of Oxfordshire.' The article is dated October, 1759, and occupies four C. A. WHITE.


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SIR JOHN MENNES, KNT. (8th S. iii. 86, 153). His will, dated May 15, 1669, was proved March 9, 1670/1 ("38 Duke "), in the Prerogative Court of Canterbury. As this was within a month of his death (as given ante, p. 86, by MR. HIPWELL) the "search in vain" of W. C. W. cannot have been a very long one. In this will he leaves his lands, &c., at Loughton, co. Essex, &c., to Francis Hammon, son of his late sister Mary Hammon, which Francis is, I presume, the one inquired after. G. E. C.

"CROCODILE" (8th S. iii. 127).-In this ladies'college-famous town, the name is shortened to croc." Many a time have I heard my daughter talk of "Miss [occasionally omitted] So-and-so's croc." P. J. F. GANTILLON. Cheltenham, MUSIC AT NORWICH (8th S. iii. 69).-See Annual Register,' vol. xliv. p. 456. A. L. HUMPHREYS.

187, Piccadilly, W.

BIBLIOGRAPHY OF SCHOOL AND COLLEGE MAGAZINES (7th S. iv. 5, 110; v. 476; vi. 93, 214; xii. 75; 8th S. i. 116).-"The Martlet. Edited by Q.SS. and T.BB. S. Peter's College, Westminster." No. 1. March 1, 1893, price 3d., 8vo., six leaves. Q.SS., Queen's Scholars; T.BB., Town Boys. Strictly speaking, I believe, only Q.SS. belong to St. Peter's College. The Martlet takes its name from the charge on the school coat of arms, adopted from that of Edward the Confessor. W. C. B.

"BURN THE BELLOWS >> (8th S. ii. 527; iii. 77, Old Rose and burn the bellows," there can be no 173).-Whatever may be the origin of "Sing doubt as to its wide-spread usage as a kind of interjectional saying, à propos of nothing, but expressive of pleasurable excitement. Here in the West it is one of our commonest expressions of jollity, or devil-may-care hilarity. It is so given Som. Grammar, p. 95 (E.D.S., 1877). The note as a sample of our cumbrous interjections in W. in 'Ingoldsby Legends' quoted by A. T. M. is in the Second Series, p. 255, ed. 1852, Legend of Dover.' FRED. T. ELWORTHY.

Wellington, Somerset.

STRACHEY FAMILY (8th S. ii. 508; iii. 14, 134).

"COLIAR HOLDERS : "WOODICH - SILVER HOLDERS (8th S. iii. 149).-" Coliar-holders " were tenants who held lands at certain small rents, and were bound to turn over and put in the lord's-This may be brought closer home, though ingrass, and had an allowance of a halfpenny for every fork and rake, and, finding themselves, were to cock it into grass cocks, ready for the copyholders.

"Woodich-silver-holders" ranked as freeholders of a manor by performing suit of court, but the exact service is not mentioned. See, also, Green's 'Antiquities of Framlingham and Saxsted in Suffolk,' 8vo. 1834. C. GOLDING. Colchester.

volving a question of date, in the production of 'Twelfth Night.' The Honourable Honora Denny, a lady of high descent and great heiress, was married in 1606 to James Hay, Master of the Wardrobe; this gentleman became Earl of Carlisle, and the point is that English dene means valley, and so, equating strach with strath, Strachey is Denny. Twelfth Night' was acted 1601-2, perhaps earlier, but not known in print till it appeared in the folio of 1623; still it shows traces

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