all our dues are extremely low; our entry dues for a steamer are $5, and this not only includes this duty but it is also the fee or payment to the pilot, whereas in New York the charge is from fifty to sixty dollars. I shall make, however, a slight amendment only in the wording of the article in debate.

I take the liberty of suggesting that it would be advisable to substitute (in the Spanish text) for the word " cargas" the word "impuestos," so that instead of "todas las cargas que afectan á las naves por derechos de puerto," it read "todos los impuestos que afectan á las naves, etc."

I think this is the idea of the committee as it has been explained.

Mr. ESTEE. May I ask my friend from Colombia a question? We will suppose a vessel goes there and unloads 2,000 tons of freight. I do not mean that the tonnage of the vessel should be 2,000 tons; it may be 5,000; but it unloads 2,000 tons of freight. will be the port dues?

Mr. HURTADO. It will be a dollar a ton.

What

Mr. ESTEE. Well, that would be $2,000. It seems to me that that is about as heavy as you will have under the mode proposed.

Mr. HURTADO, Yes; but we have not any vessels with 2,000 tons. We have vessels with 10 to 50 tons, but not such large vessels.

Mr. STUDEBAKER. What are your pilot dues?

Mr. HURTADO. Five dollars; two and one-half for small vessels.

Mr. ESTEE. If we could agree upon some uniform system, I ask my friend if he does not think it would be better to do so?

Mr. HURTADO. We have no objection at all to accepting the proposals, because they do not bind the Governments, and if they think it proper for them to come in and put a low tax, why, all right.

Mr. ESTEE. We can not any of us bind our countries, of course.

Mr. HURTADO. As a rule our vessels in Colombia are small. I wish we had some of those 2,000-ton vessels. We have never had them since the country came into existence.

Mr. STUDEBAKER. It occurs to me that the object of this Conference is to accomplish results beneficial to all the countries. We have matters of the character here discussed occurring in our commerce through the States of this country. One town has to give aid oftentimes to another. Now, the idea of this is to get uniform results. It seems to me that these nations can very readily afford to assume this charge for themselves in order to stimulate the commerce of the country and make it equal to that of the other nations. Under the rule they propose they would virtually accomplish nothing, because any nation might have some way of getting out of the payment of those dues. The real object of this Conference is to simplify and bring about such reforms as will create more commerce and trade. Therefore, I think that the report of this committee simplies the matter. We were aware that there were charges of this kind in some of the countries, but we could very easily meet them and equalize the matter with all the countries.

Mr. VARAS. Referring, Mr. President, to the motion which the honorable delegate from the Argentine has

been pleased to frame, I hardly need to recall that in our Conference, we can not dictate regulations, nor can we impose laws, nor establish legislation of an absolute and mandatory character; our end is to make recommendations, formulate suggestions, which may be practicable, which may be accepted by the Governments of the several countries here represented. Since the honorable delegates from the Argentine Republic and from Colombia, without attacking or opposing in any way the idea expressed in this article, present an existing fact, a fact which is a difficulty, which I can not call material, but which I can qualify as real in its immediate application to the subject, I think, coinciding with the ideas expressed by honorable fellow-committeemen, that the opinion of the Conference which has already undoubtedly expressed itself in favor of this merging of dues, can be sustained, having respect for existing conditions and essaying to solve them so as to reach this principal result.

my

To this end, the contracts could be carried out, if the honorable delegates were to accept an amendment in this form or in some other similar, "during the continuance of said contracts."

Expressing in this way that the honorable delegates agree that the charges called port dues shall be included in the tonnage dues, but that there being a present difficulty for the Governments of some countries to merge the light-house dues into the single tonnage charge, because of the existence of contracts, those dues will be maintained during the continuance of the contracts upon which the dues are founded.

I know not if this or another similar form will be agreeable to the ideas and purposes we entertain.

Mr. QUINTANA. I shall not reply to the remarks made by the honorable delegate from the United States-let the words of the honorable delegate from Chili, a member of the same committee, serve as a sufficient reply. Our purpose is to promote trade and reduce dues, not by the means a committee may believe possible, but by the means each delegation may think acceptable. Otherwise the honorable delegate from Chili has perfectly interpreted the sentiments and ideas of the Argentine delegation in this matter. It stated at the last session and also in the present, that it would vote for the committee's plan as a whole ; which means that we are in favor of the unification of those charges called port dues.

With respect to the proposition to add something in order that it may be understood to apply to contracts now existing and not future contracts, I have to say that the wording I submitted excludes all fear of reference to new contracts.

Mr. VARAS. I did not have the amendment before me and the honorable delegate will be good enough to pardon me.

Mr. QUINTANA. Certainly. I used the word "concluded" which is in the past tense, but with a desire to elucidate still more this idea, because these words which serve as an authentic interpretation will not always be kept at hand, it will be sufficient to strike out the word "concluded" and insert this other, “pending."

As a matter of fact, after a certain number of years, the light-houses must belong to the Government and

I am perfectly sure that this condition once reached, it will not occur to any Government to charge commerce with any light-house dues.

I do not know whether this case is sufficiently clear to the honorable delegate.

Mr. VARAS. It appears to me to be sufficiently full, and perhaps in this connection the idea might be made more clear, providing for the case of another charge which may not come under the head of light-house dues.

*

Mr. QUINTANA. I have so framed it, Mr. Delegate; the motion says, 66* light-house and other, etc." Mr. VARAS. Exactly, Mr. Delegate. I concur. Mr. ROMERO. I agree entirely with the amendment offered by the honorable delegate from Colombia, and in order that the vote of our delegation may be with that of the majority of the Conference, I shall make an explanation for our benefit and that of some other honorable delegates.

The honorable delegate from Colombia has said that the legislation of his country is more liberal than that which it is intended to establish by this plan. I think that that of Mexico is still more liberal than that of Colombia, without this being intended as comparison at all, because in Mexico no tonnage dues are charged on foreign steamers or vessels arriving at. its ports.

In another committee, to which I have the honor to belong-that of customs regulations—a question similar to this arose: The question was whether consular certifications, manifests, or bills of lading should be done away with or not, and as the honorable delegate from Chili, a member of that committee,