SUBCOMMITTEE OF THE COMMITTEE ON BANKING AND CURRENCY, HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES, The subcommittee met at 11 o'clock a. m. Present: Messrs. Pujo (chairman), Stephens, Daugherty, Byrnes, Neeley, and Heald. Present also: Samuel Untermyer, Esq., of New York City, counsel for the committee. The CHAIRMAN. The committee will come to order and the taking of testimony will be resumed. Mr. UNTERMYER. Mr. Baker, will you please resume the stand. TESTIMONY OF MR. GEORGE F. BAKER-Continued. Mr. BAKER. Mr. Untermyer, may I be allowed to make a little statement? Mr. UNTERMYER. Yes. Mr. BAKER. You presented me before the public as such a great director man, more than I realized myself, that I would just like to interject here that I never have become a director or a voting trustee from solicitation of my own; it has all come to me, rather Mr. UNTERMYER. You recognize, Mr. Baker, that we have just begun to examine you as to your directorships. Do you know how many you have? Mr. BAKER. I know I have too many. Mr. UNTERMYER. Do you know how many? Mr. BAKER. No. Mr. UNTERMYER. Have you got 25? Mr. BAKER. I guess so. Mr. UNTERMYER. Have you got 50? Mr. BAKER. There must be 25 in the Jersey Central and those little companies. Mr. UNTERMYER. Outside of the Jersey Central and outside of the Reading and outside of the anthracite roads, do you know how many directorships you have? Mr. BAKER. No; I do not know. I have never counted them up. Mr. UNTERMYER. You were asked to supply the committee with a list giving your directorships. Mr. BAKER. Was it not done? Mr. UNTERMYER. No; it was not done. Mr. UNTERMYER. The witness was asked to supply the committee some time ago with a list of the corporations in which he and other directors of the First National were directors. Mr. SPOONER. Including churches? Mr. UNTERMYER. We would like to have this proceeding conducted with as much decorum as possible, Senator Spooner. Mr. SPOONER. I would like to have it so conducted. Mr. UNTERMYER. I call your attention, Mr. Baker Mr. BAKER. Mr. Untermyer, I think that was supplied. I remember seeing one with something of the sort given out. Mr. UNTERMYER. We have not seen any such list. Mr. BAKER. My son says it was forwarded. Mr. UNTERMYER. You did supply, did you not, a list without stating which of the officers or directors were directors in each of the different corporations given. [Handing witness paper.] this the list you supplied and the only one? Is Mr. BAKER. That is correct, Mr. Untermyer, and that was the way we understood the question. Mr. UNTERMYER. This paper will be marked as an exhibit. The statement referred to was marked Exhibit No. 197 and will be found set forth at the end of to-day's record. Mr. UNTERMYER. You understood, did you not, that the letter called for information of business and financial corporations? Mr. BAKER. I can not remember that. Mr. UNTERMYER. After striking out from the list the three which I have stricken out, which are not financial and business corporations, you find that here are 88 corporations shown on the list in which the members of your board of the First National Bank are also directors? Mr. BAKER. Yes, sir. This is not only mine, but the other members of the board? Mr. UNTERMYER. Yes. Mr. BAKER. Yes; that is right. Mr. UNTERMYER. Have you not prepared a list of the corporations, business and financial, in which you are a director? Mr. BAKER. Not separately. This is the only one. Mr. UNTERMYER. Does that list also show by a red cross opposite the names those corporations in which you and Mr. Morgan, or a member of the firm of J. P. Morgan, are both directors? Mr. BAKER. No, sir; I think not. The first one I strike is the Baldwin Locomotive Co. I am not a director in that. Mr. UNTERMYER. Well, does not that red mark indicate the instances in which one of your directors in the First National, together with Mr. Morgan, or a member of the firm of J. P. Morgan & Co., are both both directors in the same corporation? The note at the bottom says so. Mr. BAKER. Oh, yes, sir. In those that I had run down I did not see it. Mr. UNTERMYER. How many such corporations are there shown by this? Mr. BAKER. I do not know. I have not examined it. Mr. UNTERMYER. There are 37. Mr. BAKER. Thirty-seven. I will accept your figures. Mr. UNTERMYER. You just referred to the Baldwin Locomotive Works as being one of the companies in which you are not a director? Mr. BAKER. Yes. Mr. UNTERMYER. And in which a member of the firm of Morgan & Co. is a director? Mr. BAKER. I am quite certain there is one of our board in there. Mr. UNTERMYER. Which member of your board is, with a member of the firm of J. P. Morgan & Co., on the board of the Baldwin Locomotive Works? Mr. BAKER. Mr. Morton. Mr. UNTERMYER. Your vice president? Mr. BAKER. Yes. Mr. UNTERMYER. Is it or not the fact that both he and one of the Morgan partners went on that board following the flotation of an issue of securities for the Baldwin Locomotive Co. by the First National and Morgan & Co.? Mr. BAKER. I think I was in Europe at the time. I think that is so. Mr. UNTERMYER. Do you not know that your bank and Messrs. Morgan & Co. floated that issue? Mr. BAKER. Yes. But who was in the board I do not happen to know. Mr. UNTERMYER. Was it an issue of preferred stock? Mr. BAKER. I do not know that. Mr. UNTERMYER. Do you know how much it was? Mr. BAKER. No, sir. Mr. UNTERMYER. Will you furnish the committee a list of the business and financial corporations in which you are a director? Mr. BAKER. Is not that sufficient? Mr. UNTERMYER. No; that is not sufficient, because that includes other directors in your bank and not yourself alone. Mr. BAKER. Yes. Mr. FISHER A. BAKER. He can give that from that paper, Mr. Untermyer, as well as to have a long tale Mr. UNTERMYER. Mr. Baker, do you think you could take up this list and state each instance in which you yourself are a director? Mr. BAKER. Yes. Mr. UNTERMYER. From the list? Mr. BAKER. Yes, sir; I think I could. I could just make a check mark against that. Mr. UNTERMYER. If you will do that at the recess, make a dagger mark (†) on Exhibit 197, against each of the corporations in which you are a director, that will be considered as your answer on that subject. Mr. BAKER. All right, sir. I will be very glad to do it. Mr. UNTERMYER. Have you brought here a copy of the resolutions from the minutes of the meetings of the directors of the First National Bank and of the First Security Co. relating to the organization of those companies, and the relations existing between them, and the manner in which the stock of the company was to be held? Mr. BAKER. Did we not make a reply to you about that, Mr. Untermyer? |