On the Motion of the CHAIRMAN OF pressing our sympathy with Her Majesty COMMITTEES ordered

most dreadful attempt. The noble Earl has very justly said that no purpose could have been answered by it; but this wretched conspiracy of Fenians, having no power to effect anything against the authority of the Crown or Government, appears to have taken a general licence to commit the crime of murder in any part of the world. I, therefore, entirely agree with the Address to Her Majesty which the noble Earl has moved.

Resolved and Ordered, Nemine Dissentiente, That an humble Address be presented to Her Majesty, to convey to Her Majesty the Expression of the Sorrow and Indignation with which this House has learned the atrocious Attempt to as sassinate His Royal Highness the Duke of Edinburgh while on a Visit to Her Majesty's loyal Australian Colonies, and of their heartfelt Congratulations to Her Majesty on his Preservation from mortal Injury; and to assure Her Majesty of the Sympathy of this House in Her Majesty's present Anxiety, and of their earnest Hope for the speedy Recovery of His Royal Highness.

of Education who was to be a Secretary of State; and, secondly, it made provision for taking what was called an "educational Census." Now, such a Census would no doubt be a very good thing; but he did not think the machinery provided for taking it was the best that could be devised. Those points, however, did not go to the principle of the Bill, and could be, perhaps, better discussed in Committee than on the present occasion. He was very glad the Government had put a Conscience Clause in the Bill, although he wished they had gone a little further in that direction. He hoped before the Session was over there would be an extended Conscience Clause applied imperatively to every school receiving public money, and that to this end they would have the valuable assistance of the right rev. Bench. He said this because his noble Friend (Earl Granville) had stated that he had been informed by a very rev. Prelate that the great majority of the clergy of the Church of England were in favour of a Conscience Clause, and that it was only a small but active minority who were opposed to it. A very eminent Member of the Government (Sir John Pakington) was in favour of a Conscience Clause much more extensive than that contained in this Bill. The right hon. Baronet had propared a draft Report in which it was proposed that no building grant should be made to any school in regard to which there was not a Conscience Clause; and further that if, on investigation, it should be found that the children of Dissenters attending a National School had been compelled either to submit to religious teaching Moved, "That the Bill be now read 2a." the Church or the Church School, the Mito which the parents object, or to attend -(The Lord President.)

The said Address to be presented to Her Majesty by the Lords with White Staves.

EDUCATION BILL-(No. 53.)
(The Lord President.)
SECOND READING.

Order of the Day for the Second Reading read.

THE DUKE OF MARLBOROUGH, in moving that the Bill be now read the second time said, that, in laying it on the table, he had stated his views so fully he did not now think it necessary to trouble their Lordships with any additional observations.

THE EARL OF AIRLIE, in moving that the Bill be read the second time that day three months, said, he could assure the noble Duke that he had been most unwilling to take any step which might appear wanting in courtesy to him by the short Notice he had given of his present Motion. He gave his Notice immediately on his return to town-he could not give it before Easter because he did not know what effect the division on the Irish Church Resolutions would have on the Government. He had examined the Bill with great care, and he found in it only two provisions which could not be effected by Minutes of the Privy Council. First, it proposed the appointment of a Minister

nister should be empowered in his discretion to suspend the annual grant to such school. As to the Bill itself it might truly be said that, with some minor alterations and additions, it was intended merely to embody in an Act of Parliament what was known as the Revised Code. This ap peared to him to be not only unnecessary but mischievous; and it was the more remarkable inasmuch as it had been stated by the author of that Code that it never would have passed if it had been necessary that its provisions should be embodied in an Act of Parliament. By one provision of the Bill, schools with uncertificated teachers might receive a grant. Now that could be done a present by a Minute of the Privy Council, and more expediently done

in that way than by Act of Parliament, because, if the arrangement did not answer, it could then be easily altered. He also thought it better to leave the increase or diminution of the building grant, in like manner to the discretion of the Education Committee of the Privy Council. He had no objection to the appointment of a Minister of Education, if work enough were given to that functionary to perform, and if they clothed him with active powers. If he had, for instance, the initiative in matters of elementary education, the control of endowed schools and of educational charities, then he might possibly have work enough for a Cabinet Minister; but if he were to be tied down within the four corners of the present Bill, the work might just as well be done by a permanent Under Secretary with an efficient staff of clerks. He was of opinion that it was an objection to the Bill that it was intended, as stated by the noble Duke (the Duke of Marlborough) in introducing the measure, to make the existing system a national system. While it must be admitted that the present system had effected much good, yet it must be at the same time allowed that it had several grave defects. It was a very extravagant system-it had a needless multiplication of schools and schoolmasters and Inspectors; and he understood that the other night the Chancellor of the Exchequer stated that the increase in the Civil Service Estimates was partially due to the Vote for Education. There was also inequality in the way in which it pressed on those who maintained the schools, and there was a total absence of that local organization, which the best judges of the matter had always said was absolutely necessary for the efficient working of a national system. Again, the present system did not meet the requirements of those districts which most required assistance; for it was in the great towns, and not in the rural districts that the machinery for extending the advantages of education was most wanted. Neither did the Bill check expenditure, but tended greatly to increase it. He did not wish to see the present system interfered with where it was working well, for it had done a considerable amount of good; but when they were going to occupy new ground they ought to adopt a system founded on a sounder basis, and which would prove more efficient.

He thought there was an overwhelming preponderance of opinion among persons well informed on the subject

against the expediency and possibility of extending the present system so as to make it national. Last year it was stated in the second Report of the Scotch Education Commission that

"Upon the whole we think it must be admitted that the Privy Council system neither is, nor can it by any alteration be enlarged into, a national system."

Two years ago a Committee of the House of Commons was appointed to inquire into the subject of Education at the instance of Sir John Pakington, and before that Committee a great number of witnesses were examined-among others Mr. Lingen, who gave it as his opinion that it would be impossible to extend the present system throughout the whole country; that we must fall back upon local organization of some kind, and that he considered the organization of the parish schools in Scotland a type well worth studying for this country. He went on to say that he should prefer the local organization, which would have the best chance of being adopted in this country.

Whether it were based on the county, the union, or the parish he should look upon as a matter of comparative indifference. Again, the Rev. William Kennedy, one of Her Majesty's Inspectors for Lancashire, with an experience of twenty years, declared that he saw no other mode, after long consideration, by which assistance could be extended to neglected districts; that he was of opinion that a feeling was springing up in favour of rate-supported schools, and that he thought it absolutely necessary to consti tute local bodies for the management of the schools; adding that he did not see that the religious difficulty need interfere with the plan, provided the Conscience Clause was universally imposed, and that he was strongly in favour of that being done. Such were the opinions not only of an Inspector of great experience, but of a clergyman of the Church of England; and it was not only his individual opinion, but he believed that the majority of the clergy of the Church of England were not op posed to the Conscience Clause, stating it to be the result of his experience, as an Inspector in Lancashire, that he knew only of one clergyman there who would not act upon it in his schools. The noble Earl below him, he might add, then Lord John Russell, submitted to the House of Commons, in 1856, a series of Resolutions, the 7th, 8th, and 9th of which were as follows:

"7. That it is expedient that in any school district where the means of education arising from endowment, subscription, grants, and school pence shall be found deficient, and shall be declared to be so by the Committee of Privy Council for Education, the ratepayers should have the power of taxing themselves for the erection and maintenance of a school or schools.

"8. That, after the 1st of January, 1858, when any school district shall have been declared to be deficient in adequate means for the education of the poor the Quarter Sessions of the Peace for the county, city, or borough should have power to impose a school rate.

"9. That where a school rate is imposed a school committee elected by the ratepayers, should appoint the schoolmasters and mistresses, and make regulations for the management of the schools."-[3 Hansard, cxl. 1971.]

a

ing his best thanks to the noble Duke and to Her Majesty's Government for bringing forward a Bill characterized by so many good proposals, and so well calculated to promote the cause of education. He was himself in favour of the Bill, and that for some of the reasons which had been urged against it by the noble Earl (the Earl of Airlie). He looked upon it, in the first place, as a step in the right direction, inasmuch as it placed matters of great importance in connection with education on a somewhat settled footing, so that the promoters of schools might with some certainty know how they were situated, instead of being liable, as hitherto, to the disadvantages arising from repeated Now, such were the Resolutions proposed changes at the caprice of the Privy Counby the noble Earl twelve years ago, and cil. As to the Conscience Clause as framed he had not, he believed, since changed in the Bill, he could only say that it met his opinions on the subject. Sir John his own individual views, and he believed Pakington was also in favour of rate-sup- the views of a very large portion of the ported schools; while a meeting which clergy; but he believed there was was recently held at Manchester, at which large portion of the clergy who would not the compulsory rating principle was advo- be satisfied with the Conscience Clause cated, was largely attended by clergymen, proposed in the other Bill. If by means by whom no disapproval of it was ex- of such a measure a long vexed question pressed. For his own part, knowing how could be set at rest, as he trusted it might, well it had worked in Scotland, he must a great benefit would, he thought, be conconfess that he was strongly attached to ferred on the Church and on the nation. the rating principle, and as a landowner, He was glad, he might add, that rating and looking only at the results of the clauses were not included among its provisystem in a pecuniary point of view, he sions, inasmuch as he was of opinion that felt that he gained more by having a well- their introduction would be premature, educated tenantry and labourers on his until after the proposed general Census estate than he should have had to pay in was taken, and the educational wants of Consequence of any charge which was im- the country thus accurately ascertained; posed on him to secure that object. If for there were facts before them which they wished to extend education through- would show, if he were not mistaken, that out the country, and they were driven to in the different dioceses of England there choose between the Bill of the Governwas a much larger number of the children ment and that of his right hon. Friend of the poor now brought under the influ(Mr. Bruce) in the other House, he ence of education than was supposed. should greatly prefer the latter. The did not think it necessary to go into the two were totally different in principle-details on which the noble Earl (the Earl one must kill the other. Entertaining of Airlie) had touched; if there were any those views, and believing that the Bill of the Government was a complete abnegation of the principle that the State ought to educate the people, he should move that it be read a second time that day three months.

Amendment moved to leave out ("now") and insert ("this Day Three Months.") (The Earl of Airlie.)

THE ARCHBISHOP OF CANTERBURY said, that not having been present when this Bill was introduced, and not having had an opportunity before of expressing an opinion upon it, he was desirous of tender

Ile

defects they might be remedied in Committee; but he thought there were some very essential provisions in this Bill, well calculated to help forward the cause of education, and he was prepared to give the measure his hearty support.

THE EARL OF KIMBERLEY said, that

to a certain extent he concurred in the opinions expressed by his noble Friend (the Earl of Airlie) in regard to the Bill. Some of the details of the measure seemed to be extremely useful, and reflected credit on the Government; but it was much to be lamented that they had thought it necessary to embody the whole system of